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@Best.Korea
Yeah, how very caring of you.
That’s coming from a guy who has R-18 Anime all over the walls of his bedroom
The transgenderism debate
Posts
Total:
673
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@oromagi
Yes, Sometimes, a baby can have genitalia with some male characteristics and some female characteristics. And even deeper than external appearance, some people are born with a mix of male and female biological features (such as a uterus and testicles) that can’t be seen on the outside.
When someone doesn’t fall exactly into the “male” or “female” sex designation, the term “intersex” may be used.
When someone doesn’t fall exactly into the “male” or “female” sex designation, the term “intersex” may be used.
That’s coming from a guy who has R-18 Anime all over the walls of his bedroom
Ouch.
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@Best.Korea
Ouch
Ouch is right, weirdo
weirdo
No. Right now, I identify as "puppy". Please use correct pronouns and refer to me as "puppy".
Liz Wheeler speech on the IDEOLOGY of Trangenderism.
“Gender theorists are lying to you.”
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@TWS1405_2
I watched it. Wheeler is long on accusations and short on sources. She knows how to make a good presentation. I don't get how she makes the connection between BLM / queer theory and marxism. I read about her online and found that she had been accused of lying many times. I guess I will have to consult more sources to figure her out.
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@oromagi
- Crazy talk. Let's agree a large group of people believe the sun rises in the east. Is that belief an ideology?
But we have scientific, evidence of this happening.
If we didn't it would be a belief, but we do.
We don't have scientific, evidence for biological men, becoming biological women. We don't have evidence for biological men menstruating. And we don't have evidence for men giving birth.
Therefore, it is a belief, and a very false one at that.
- Quite false. Transgender people are only honestly reporting their feeling that their personal identity doesn't match the identity assigned them at birth. There is no choice or belief system involved that is the unkind prejudice you impose upon them by assuming they are insincere in their reports.
- You cannot produce a single example of a transman claiming that he is biologically identical to a cisman. Some transmen still menstruate and get pregnant and all transmen will acknowledge that this is a biological difference between transmen and cismen.
I want you to go to any transgender identifying person, and ask them if they think, men can become women, if men can menstruate, and if men can get pregnant.
personal identity doesn't match the identity assigned them at birth.
So, men, who don't feel like men, can become women?
transman claiming that he is biologically identical to a cisman.
Here's a great quote from Jordan Peterson:
"If you're a man born in a woman's body, that's biologically determined, but if you're a woman born in a woman's body, that's socially constructed?"
The argument I see you trying to make without saying it outload, is that gender does not have to align with your sex therefore men can become women, and women can become men in a sense.
You're saying that men can get pregnant, but only Trans-men.
So now not only do you have two switchable genders at whatever feeling you might have, but now you have 4 genders. 2 different types of women, and 2 different types of men, then only to realize that the trans-men are women pretending to be men, and trans-women are men pretending to be women.
There are 2 genders. Almost everyone agrees with that. And it is socially constructed based off of your biological sex.
I have never heard someone claim what you are claiming, where transgenderism isn't a mental illness, but also doesn't align with biology, and goes against the fact of two genders.
It's honestly absurd.
- False. Men can legally become women. Women can legally become men.
Legally, not biologically. Again, biology does in fact determine your gender, regardless of how you feel. Facts don't care about your feelings.
If you're a man, and you feel like a woman, then great, but the facts don't care.
Some transmen menstruate and get pregnant.
Also yes, women can menstruate and get pregnant, that is obvious.
- As explained to you many, many times without sinking in.: The ideology you describe is a real ideology belonging to Feminism and predating even the word Transgender. Transgenderism has a meaning that describes an human experience and not an ideology. When you use the wrong label for the ideology, you are disrepecting the experience as well as the Feminsts right to authorship of the ideology you oppose.
What the hell are you talking about. Feminism and Transgenderism clash in almost all aspects.
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@b9_ntt
I watched it. Wheeler is long on accusations and short on sources. She knows how to make a good presentation. I don't get how she makes the connection between BLM / queer theory and marxism. I read about her online and found that she had been accused of lying many times. I guess I will have to consult more sources to figure her out.
I’m pleased to see someone take the time to watch something.
The BLM/QT/M connection is the premise behind CRT and intersectionality applied to minorities and/or so-called marginalized groups.
The topic was supposed to be about the ideology of transgenderism, the BLM/QT/M route was a bit of a stretch; however, QT plays a strong part in pushing/peddling the “lies” of transgenderism ideology though.
when it comes to People like her, Ben Shapario, Amalya, Charlie Kirk, so on and so forth…someone in the left will always [claim] she (they) lied about something, but they can never truly articulate what it is she (they) lied about.
Again? Thanks for watching and commenting.
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@TWS1405_2
You're welcome. I'll try to come back with some arguments or info.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
Yeah, I do. I don't have racist pals,You’re a self declared white nationalist, a racist, and you want people to believe your friends aren’t racist too?
My friends and I don't have racial animus towards people of different races.
I don't think there is a point in responding to him on this topic anymore.Do yourself a favor Kaitlyn, get off this chat site and go find yourself a husband before it’s too late and you end up all alone with no children like most of the conservative losers on this site.
Conservative people are actually more likely to be married and have families.
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@Kaitlyn
Conservative people are actually more likely to be married and have families.
Maybe he meant for you to get a female husband as he may be a male wife.
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@Greyparrot
Conservative people are actually more likely to be married and have families.Maybe he meant for you to get a female husband as he may be a male wife.
That's actually disgusting.
It's even more disgusting that he might have meant it like that.
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@YouFound_Lxam
why it would benefit society
It actually doesn't at all - longitude studies suggest that transitioning is highly deleterious as a mechanism for stress release to the gender dysphoric.
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@Bones
It actually doesn't at all - longitude studies suggest that transitioning is highly deleterious as a mechanism for stress release to the gender dysphoric.
My point exactly.
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@Double_R
We know that transgender people have an increased suicide risk for some reason. We know that this reason is not caused by bullyingSerious question; are you reading the studies you are citing? Here is what your own study said about that:ResultsVictimisation and mental health were key risk factors across the dimension self-harm and suicide identified through all analyses.Which study?(3) Suicidal transgender people also typically don't cite bullying as a reason for their attempts at suicide A systematic review and meta-analysis of victimisation and mental health prevalence among LGBTQ+ young people with experiences of self-harm and suicide | PLOS ONE
Yes, the study does say that, but let's look at the number they used to make that conclusion:
The "suicide attempt" "prevalence rate" was 0.26, meaning that 74% of LGBTQ+ people (not all trans to be fair) did not cite bullying/harassment as a reason for their suicide attempt (Table 3, page 11: A systematic review and meta-analysis of victimisation and mental health prevalence among LGBTQ+ young people with experiences of self-harm and suicide | PLOS ONE ) . Self-harm (0.39) and Suicidal ideation (0.35) prevalence rates were higher, but again do not explain the majority of transgender people's suicide-related activities.
If the issue with transgender people was merely that they were bullied/harassed, we would expect 100%, not sub-50%.
Incorrect.You were the one who failed to respond to my defense of the source The transgenderism debate (debateart.com) (people can see that you never responded after that).Correct, I missed that. My apologies.
Alright. I'll back off.
You're claiming we should treat trans people as mentally ill and one of the studies you cite in support of this claim is the one concluding that trans people are more likely to bully others than to be bullied. But here is an excerpt taken from its conclusion:Programs that promote gender diversity should be implemented in schools and in larger context in the society with the aim of reducing heteronormativity and promoting the acceptance of gender diversity.If the people you are getting your information from conclude the opposite of what you're arguing you've got a pretty weak case.
This is an interesting point.
One of the things I've noticed with some of the research papers I cite is that their data doesn't agree with their conclusions. I think this is partly because anti-transgenderism is frowned upon pretty much as much as discussion of human races (if polling of U.S. college students is anything to go by). There's a personal risk to arguing heterodox beliefs, especially when your name and college are attached to them. A great example of this is Robert Putnam (he's famous enough that you might have heard of him). He'll make graphs and tables that race realists use a lot, but his abstracts and conclusions sometimes totally contradict his data and said race realists!
So, to address your point, I don't agree with the conclusion of the paper because I don't think it follows from the data that is presented. If you still think that is weak, oh well.
The studies don't explicitly say what should be done. They are there to construct the necessary premises and arguments needed to reach my conclusion. None of them by themselves reach the conclusion that transgenderism is a mental illness.And you don't find it odd that with all these professionals out there studying this stuff there is no serious movement within the medication community who agrees with you?
I'm not interested in appeals to authority. Authority used to think that the Earth was flat.
I'm interested in data and interpretation of it. That's how good, logically valid arguments are constructed.
Much as we treat schizophrenics with dignity and respect, we should treat transgender people the same way, despite both of them having mental illnesses.We don't treat schizophrenics with dignity and respect, we treat them like children incapable of making their own decisions. Dignity and compassion are not the same thing.
Well, I respect the fact that they are humans, and thus deserve basic rights. I imagine most people think that, too.
I'm certainly not an expert on schizophrenia, but from what I'm reading, a lot of schizophrenics seem to be able to live normal lives 10 Facts You Should Know About Schizophrenia | Mental Floss . Would you not consider that dignified?
you've claimed that they're the most socially ostracized group. That was unsupported by any data.It's supported by your own studies. We've been talking for days about how they get bullied more than any other group.
Oh come on. What happened was this:
(1) You made this claim "Trans people are the most ridiculed and least welcomed people in our society." It came from this post #175 and was uncited The transgenderism debate (debateart.com)
(2) In post #287 I cited a study here The transgenderism debate (debateart.com)
We only had some data to establish that they were the most bullied in post #287. You were making a lot of unsupported claims until then.
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@YouFound_Lxam
If a man wants to dress like a woman and live like one because that's how he/she feels inside then what's the harm? If he wants to be called "she" then call him she. It costs you nothing. You don't have to date this person and offering someone this kind of basic dignity and respect costs you nothing. Be kind and let others be who they are.
Now, I agree there are some conflicting areas that society needs to work out, but some of the these are just being needlessly politicized usually by the Right, but in some cases by the Left. For example, I'm sure transwomen have been using womens' restrooms for a long time and no one cares because no one notices and no one's getting peeped or assaulted, etc. Likewise, while there should be safeguards on gender therapy, in most cases these decisions are being made only after families with this issue have long struggled over what to do and how to approach it. Sports, same thing. But it would be better if we let local communities work these things out and see what they come up with. Nationalizing these issues for political points is unhelpful and often harmful for the kids, parents, and communities.
Most of all everyone needs to take a breath and step back and let society readjust to greater inclusion of transpeople. It's not going to happen overnight. All parties would be better off with less of a spotlight on the issue.
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@Kaitlyn
My friends and I don't have racial animus towards people of different races.
You are a self declared white nationalist who doesn’t have racial animus. Ok
you believe black people a great, but whites and blacks just shouldn’t live together. People of differing races shouldn’t share the same country. You are just a race realist.
But you’re a very tolerant person. You’re not saying there should be any bloodshed, just get rid of them.
Scientific racism, sometimes termed biological racism, is the pseudoscientific belief that empirical evidence exists to support or justify racism (racial discrimination), racial inferiority, or racial superiority.[1][2][3][4] Before the mid-20th century, scientific racism received credence throughout the scientific community, but it is no longer considered scientific. Since the second half of the 20th century, scientific racism has been criticized as obsolete and discredited, yet has persistently been used to support or validate racist world-views, based upon belief in the existence and significance of racial categories and a hierarchy of superior and inferior races.
You’re a dummy Kaitlyn
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@timjohnston
If a man wants to dress like a woman and live like one because that's how he/she feels inside then what's the harm? If he wants to be called "she" then call him she. It costs you nothing. You don't have to date this person and offering someone this kind of basic dignity and respect costs you nothing. Be kind and let others be who they are.
When it comes to basic rights in America, I think it should legal for a man to dress up as a woman, and a woman to dress up as a man, because that's not the problem here. I don't think it should be legal for them to change their gender legally, or push this agenda of gender swapping on kids. That is the part I am addressing.
As for the ideology of Transgenderism, that is basically what this forum is for. To talk about how it works, and why we need it in society, because recently there has been a major push for this type of stuff.
Now, I agree there are some conflicting areas that society needs to work out, but some of the these are just being needlessly politicized usually by the Right, but in some cases by the Left. For example, I'm sure transwomen have been using womens' restrooms for a long time and no one cares because no one notices and no one's getting peeped or assaulted, etc. Likewise, while there should be safeguards on gender therapy, in most cases these decisions are being made only after families with this issue have long struggled over what to do and how to approach it. Sports, same thing. But it would be better if we let local communities work these things out and see what they come up with. Nationalizing these issues for political points is unhelpful and often harmful for the kids, parents, and communities.
I'm glad you can see these areas. I agree, the right does go to the extreme sometimes, but that is only the far right. Most conservatives you will see are trying to find a middle ground in these areas, that don't hurt kids or people.
But your wrong with some of your assumptions. Men have not been using women's restrooms for a long time, in fact this is actually a recent occurrence.
Gender Therapy is still experimental and should be tested before giving it out to the public, and especially kids.
With sports, it doesn't matter how you identify, a biological man will always have an advantage over a biological woman. That is factual. Your feelings don't get to dictate the outcome of sports.
Also nationalizing issues that hurt kids already is important to stop this hurting of kids.
Most of all everyone needs to take a breath and step back and let society readjust to greater inclusion of transpeople. It's not going to happen overnight. All parties would be better off with less of a spotlight on the issue.
No.
Society would be far better off if we did the opposite and rejected this ideology.
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@YouFound_Lxam
Here's a great quote from Jordan Peterson:"If you're a man born in a woman's body, that's biologically determined, but if you're a woman born in a woman's body, that's socially constructed?"
His question is on point. Chalk another one up for the incoherency argument. In addition, because gender labels are becoming so convoluted now, one must add qualifiers to clarify these terms. For example: “a man born in a cisgender woman’s body.” Otherwise, who can say what distinguishes a woman’s body from a man’s? Some men can produce eggs and get pregnant. Some circles have corners.
Here’s a really good discussion on this subject involving Jordan Peterson if you haven’t already seen it:
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@Kaitlyn
If the issue with transgender people was merely that they were bullied/harassed, we would expect 100%, not sub-50%.
We would never expect 100% of anything.
The claim was never that bullying is the only difference, the point is that there's nothing odd about the fact that a group which has been largely ostracized by society (which the bullying statistics support) would have a higher suicide rate. It would be absurd to expect any other result.
I'm not interested in appeals to authority. Authority used to think that the Earth was flat.I'm interested in data and interpretation of it. That's how good, logically valid arguments are constructed.
If it's not an appeal to authority fallacy (appealing to something that's not an authority) then dismissing it out of hand is the opposite of being rational.
If you go to a doctor and he tells you that you need surgery to live, then unless you have expertise in the field yourself you are being irrational to dismiss his assessment. If you go to 9 other doctors and they all tell you that you will live without it, you are on clear solid grounds to reject the first doctor's assessment.
Appeal to authority is not about validity, it's about strength. When you disagree with the majority of experts in a field, that weakens your case.
I'm certainly not an expert on schizophrenia, but from what I'm reading, a lot of schizophrenics seem to be able to live normal lives 10 Facts You Should Know About Schizophrenia | Mental Floss . Would you not consider that dignified?
I don't see how any of this matters with regards to the topic we are addressing.
You asked me if we should treat trans people liked schizophrenics, now you're showing me extremely mild cases that have no harmful impact. If there's no harm involved or not enough harm to warrant intervention then I fail to see your point.
We only had some data to establish that they were the most bullied in post #287. You were making a lot of unsupported claims until then.
Have you never heard of hyperboli?
While I do think they are the most ostracized group, whether there is another group more ostracized or whether we could even define ostracized well enough to study it is all beside the point. I was speaking from personal observation and pointing out something that is quite frankly pretty obvious. I mean seriously, just look at the threads on this site. I find it odd that someone who is spending so much time and effort to make the case that trans people are mentally ill is also going to put all this time and effort into arguing that this same group is not excessively ostracized.
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@timjohnston
@YouFound_Lxam
If a man wants to dress like a woman and live like one because that's how he/she feels inside then what's the harm?
I know you’re clearly late to this discussion, but I would like to think that the answer to your question is fairly obvious.
It’s infiltrating public education, legislation, laws, court decisions, scotus decisions legislating from the bench in order to pander to it, it’s in television, it’s in YouTube videos (the beast), product advertisement, in our girls/women’s sports and their safe spaces (bathrooms, locker rooms), it’s forcefully altering language and punishing those who don’t agree or use the right pronouns. I can go on and on and on. It is a big deal. And it’s all premised on a mental disorder that’s invading the lives of children. WA state is even going so far as passing legislation allowing the state to legally kidnap your child if you don’t agree with their wishes to be called Johnny instead of Jane and place them in either a liberal or alphabet soup foster home while they transition without your further knowledge or acceptance.
The ideology of transgenderism is so pronounced and so widespread that there is no need to describe it in detail. What occasions a statement from the National Association of Scholars on it are several of the ways that that ideology has disrupted American education at all levels. These include:
Vitriolic attacks on faculty members and medical professionals who dissent from the transgender orthodoxy2
Insisting that faculty members and students divulge their “preferred pronouns” and that others address and refer to people by these pronouns.3
The readiness of competitive sports to permit individuals of one sex to compete in single-sex contests of the opposite sex.4
The designation of gender-inclusive restrooms on campus. Yale, for example, has 332 such designated restrooms created at the reported cost of $8.3 million.5
The insistence that archaeologists and forensic anthropologists cease classifying human skeletal remains as male or female, since we do not know the “gender identification” of the individuals.6
Distortion of the medical school curriculum and consequences for healthcare.7 #53
The ideology of transgenderism is built on a lie. Ever hear of doctor money? It’s because of him that started the lies and misinformation about trans and the ability to raise a child successfully as the opposite sex/gender than what they were biologically born as.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
@Kaitlyn
Hey IwantRooskies,
you believe black people a great, but whites and blacks just shouldn’t live together. People of differing races shouldn’t share the same country. You are just a race realist.
Here is something you should note from your own glorious way of life:
If you take time to read it, it says that you would endorse a SEGREGATED graduation ceremony!! They literally will have a separate ceremony just because they are black. They are having a different ceremony based on their skin color!
YOU AND PEOPLE LIKE YOU ARE THE RACIST, DUMMY!! LOL
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@DavidAZ
Here is something you should note from your own glorious way of life:
No idea what you are saying is my way of life but if marginalized groups want to be separate, such as an all girls school, that’s fine. It’s when they are forced to segregate it’s a violation of civil rights. Understand dummy?
“The graduation ceremonies serve as a “unique form of graduation that offers a more intimate celebration of students' academic journeys,” accorinding the university's website”
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@IwantRooseveltagain
No idea what you are saying is my way of life but if marginalized groups want to be separate, such as an all girls school, that’s fine. It’s when they are forced to segregate it’s a violation of civil rights. Understand dummy?
Touche!
“The graduation ceremonies serve as a “unique form of graduation that offers a more intimate celebration of students' academic journeys,” according the university's website”
So just a nice way to keep segregation going. I see.
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@IwantRooseveltagain
No idea what you are saying is my way of life but if marginalized groups want to be separate, such as an all girls school, that’s fine. It’s when they are forced to segregate it’s a violation of civil rights. Understand dummy?“The graduation ceremonies serve as a “unique form of graduation that offers a more intimate celebration of students' academic journeys,” accorinding the university's website”
So majority/non-marginalized groups do or do not have the "civil right" to be segregated if they want to be?
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@IwantRooseveltagain
My friends and I don't have racial animus towards people of different races.You are a self declared white nationalist who doesn’t have racial animus. Ok
That's correct, but I extend this nationalism to other races, too. It's okay to be Black. Black people should have their own spaces. It's okay to be a Black nationalist.
you believe black people a great, but whites and blacks just shouldn’t live together. People of differing races shouldn’t share the same country. You are just a race realist.
I am a race realist, yes. Everything you've said is correct so far.
But you’re a very tolerant person. You’re not saying there should be any bloodshed, just get rid of them.
It's awfully difficult once they're already here, but yes I don't think people of different races can live together peacefully enough.
Hitler tried giving Jews money to leave Germany, and we have clear ideas about how Hitler is perceived in the history books.
For the U.S. specifically, perhaps dividing the union into multiple separate ethnostates would be feasible.
Scientific racism, sometimes termed biological racism, is the pseudoscientific belief that empirical evidence exists to support or justify racism (racial discrimination), racial inferiority, or racial superiority.[1][2][3][4] Before the mid-20th century, scientific racism received credence throughout the scientific community, but it is no longer considered scientific. Since the second half of the 20th century, scientific racism has been criticized as obsolete and discredited, yet has persistently been used to support or validate racist world-views, based upon belief in the existence and significance of racial categories and a hierarchy of superior and inferior races.
Do you believe that despite evolving in different environment, all the human races are perfectly the same?
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@Kaitlyn
But you’re a very tolerant person. You’re not saying there should be any bloodshed, just get rid of them.It's awfully difficult once they're already here, but yes I don't think people of different races can live together peacefully enough.
Especially when the new interlopers, illegal or otherwise, refuse to assimilate to their new country’s cultural standards, norms, main (dominant) language and social /legal expectations.
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@YouFound_Lxam
When it comes to basic rights in America, I think it should legal for a man to dress up as a woman, and a woman to dress up as a man, because that's not the problem here. I don't think it should be legal for them to change their gender legally, or push this agenda of gender swapping on kids. That is the part I am addressing.
I'm not sure what the problem is with "legally" being anything on gender. I'm a straight male but I've never thought of myself as "legally" male, have you? Now, if there are issues with transwomen being different that women qualifying for sports or something, then I'm open to treating transwomen differently. I agree that trans parents shouldn't push their sexuality on kids, but then again, I feel the same way about straight parents. Let kids be who they are, gay, straight or whatever. Families who deal with these issues take them seriously and if there's any agenda pushing it's most often not accepting non-straight kids.
As for the ideology of Transgenderism, that is basically what this forum is for. To talk about how it works, and why we need it in society, because recently there has been a major push for this type of stuff.
I think there are tribal problems with many groups pushing their agenda in a way that's intolerant and angry. You see this on the Left and the Right. But a person being true to his sexuality isn't an "ideology". He's just being who he feels he is. Who cares? So long as it doesn't hurt others, that's fine. Now, that said, people pushing their ideology on others is different thing and like other groups I can see where the LGBTQ people may be pushing things to far in some ways but I could say the same about Christian groups or Trumpers or the excessively woke left, etc.
I'm glad you can see these areas. I agree, the right does go to the extreme sometimes, but that is only the far right. Most conservatives you will see are trying to find a middle ground in these areas, that don't hurt kids or people.
I don't agree with that overly generous assessment of conservatives. For example, most Republicans still believe, without any evidence, that Biden didn't win the election and when we're talking about 60-70% of Republicans, that's not the "far" right. I'll stop there being the topic is transpeople.
But your wrong with some of your assumptions. Men have not been using women's restrooms for a long time, in fact this is actually a recent occurrence.
I meant transwomen, not "men" and in the case of transwomen how would you even know? Are you seeing a lot of problems with transmen in men's restrooms? I think the trans community and the conservatives should just back off and don't worry about it until we need to. If there are problems, let's create some more laws about it. Until then, stop freaking out over nothing. I thought you guys on the right we all about avoiding unnecessary regulations?
Gender Therapy is still experimental and should be tested before giving it out to the public, and especially kids.
When it comes to adults, what do you care? It's none of your business what kind of surgery or drug therapy someone wants to do. Wanna pierce your nose or squirt ink into your skin or take hair from your butt and stitch it into your scale... not my business. As for kids, I agree it needs to be taken slow and maybe more controls need to be added. In particular there needs to be some kind of psychological test and counseling to help children and their parents find the best option. Still, I think it's a fair point that this drug therapy is still new. However, this hysteria that woke parents are forcing kids to be trans is a bit silly. Parents love their kids and these are not easy decisions and again, if anything, parents push their kids to be "normal," or non-gay.
With sports, it doesn't matter how you identify, a biological man will always have an advantage over a biological woman. That is factual. Your feelings don't get to dictate the outcome of sports.
Not true for all men. Some women are physically stronger than some men, but I do accept your point. I don't think transwomen should be participating in women's sports because of the unfair advantage.
Also nationalizing issues that hurt kids already is important to stop this hurting of kids.
I'm not sure how you feel kids are being hurt. If we just recognized that some kids are gay or trans and left it at that, then I don't see how that hurts anyone. I think the really important thing is for both Ds and Rs to stop politicizing this issue because THAT really hurts kids.
Society would be far better off if we did the opposite and rejected this ideology.
Again, I don't get why you think it's an "ideology", and I'm not sure what the "opposite" would look like. Not tolerating kids to be gay or trans? Gay people will always be with us. If all the gay/trans people left and went to Mars, tomorrow gay and trans kids would still be being born from straight parents. It's part of nature that some people aren't born straight or cis or whatever they are calling it.
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@timjohnston