LIZ CHENEY: AMERICANS MUST UNITE to DEFEAT TRUMP

Author: oromagi

Posts

Total: 26
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
A LITTLE OVER A YEAR AGO I RECEIVED A NOTE FROM A GOLD STAR FATHER. HE SAID TO ME, STANDING UP FOR TRUTH HONORS ALL WHO GAVE ALL AND I HAVE THOUGHT OF HIS WORDS EVERY SINGLE DAY SINCE THEN I'VE THOUGHT OF THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE A REMINDER OF HOW WE MUST ALL CONDUCT OURSELVES. WE MUST CONDUCT OURSELVES IN A WAY THAT IS WORTHY OF THE MEN AND WOMEN WHO WEAR THE UNIFORM OF THIS NATION AND IN PARTICULAR OF THOSE WHO HAVE GIVEN THE ULTIMATE SACRIFICE.

THIS IS NOT A GAME. EVERY ONE OF US MUST BE COMMITTED TO THE ETERNAL DEFENSE OF THIS MIRACULOUS EXPERIMENT CALLED AMERICA AND AT THE HEART OF OUR DEMOCRATIC PROCESS, OUR ELECTIONS. THEY ARE THE FOUNDATIONAL PRINCIPLE OF OUR CONSTITUTION. 

TWO YEARS AGO, I WON THIS PRIMARY WITH 73% OF THE VOTE. I COULD EASILY HAVE DONE THE SAME AGAIN. THE PATH WAS CLEAR BUT IT WOULD HAVE REQUIRED THAT I GO ALONG WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP'S LIE ABOUT THE 2020 ELECTION. IT WOULD HAVE REQUIRED THAT I ENABLE HIS ONGOING EFFORTS TO UNRAVEL OUR DEMOCRATIC SYSTEM AND ATTACK THE FOUNDATIONS OF OUR REPUBLIC. THAT WAS A PATH I COULD NOT AND WOULD NOT TAKE. 

NO HOUSE SEAT. NO OFFICE IN THIS LAND IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE PRINCIPLES THAT WE ARE ALL SWORN TO PROTECT AND I WELL UNDERSTOOD THE POTENTIAL POLITICAL CONSEQUENCES OF ABIDING BY MY DUTY. OUR REPUBLIC RELIES UPON THE GOODWILL OF ALL CANDIDATES FOR OFFICE TO ACCEPT HONORABLY THE OUTCOME OF ELECTIONS.   THIS PRIMARY ELECTION IS OVER BUT NOW THE REAL WORK BEGINS.

THE GREAT AND ORIGINAL CHAMPION OF OUR PARTY, ABRAHAM LINCOLN WAS DEFEATED IN ELECTIONS FOR THE SENATE AND THE HOUSE BEFORE HE WON THE MOST IMPORTANT ELECTION OF ALL. LINCOLN ULTIMATELY PREVAILED. HE SAVED OUR UNION AND HE DEFINED OUR OBLIGATION AS AMERICANS FOR ALL OF HISTORY. SPEAKING AT GETTYSBURG, OF THE GREAT TASK REMAINING BEFORE US, LINCOLN SAID THAT WE HERE HIGHLY RESOLVE THAT THESE DEAD SHALL NOT HAVE DIED IN VAIN. THAT THIS NATION UNDER GOD SHALL HAVE A NEW BIRTH OF FREEDOM AND THAT GOVERNMENT OF THE PEOPLE BY THE PEOPLE AND FOR THE PEOPLE SHALL NOT PERISH FROM THIS EARTH . AS WE MEET HERE TONIGHT, THAT REMAINS OUR GREATEST AND MOST IMPORTANT TASK.

MOST OF WORLD HISTORY IS A STORY OF VIOLENT CONFLICT[ OF SERVITUDE AND SUFFERING. MOST PEOPLE IN MOST PLACES HAVE NOT LIVED IN FREEDOM.  OUR AMERICAN FREEDOM IS A PROVIDENTIAL DEPARTURE FROM HISTORY. WE ARE THE EXCEPTION, WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN THE GIFT OF FREEDOM BY GOD AND OUR FOUNDING FATHERS. 

IT HAS BEEN SAID THAT THE LONG ARC OF HISTORY BENDS TOWARDS JUSTICE AND FREEDOM. THAT'S TRUE, BUT ONLY IF WE MAKE IT BEND. TODAY OUR HIGHEST DUTY IS TO BEND THE ARC OF HISTORY, TO PRESERVE OUR NATION AND ITS BLESSINGS TO ENSURE THAT FREEDOM WILL NOT PERISH, TO PROTECT THE VERY FOUNDATIONS OF THIS CONSTITUTIONAL REPUBLIC. 

NEVER IN OUR NATION'S 246 YEARS HAVE WE SEEN WHAT WE SAW ON JANUARY 6. LIKE SO MANY AMERICANS, I ASSUMED THAT THE VIOLENCE AND THE CHAOS OF THAT DAY WOULD HAVE PROMPTED A UNITED RESPONSE, A RECOGNITION THAT THIS WAS A LINE THAT MUST NEVER BE CROSSED, A TRAGIC CHAPTER IN OUR NATION'S HISTORY TO BE STUDIED BY HISTORIANS TO ENSURE THAT IT CAN NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN.   BUT INSTEAD, MAJOR ELEMENTS OF MY PARTY STILL VEHEMENTLY DEFENDS THOSE WHO CAUSED IT.

AT THE HEART OF THE ATTACK ON JANUARY 6, IS A WILLINGNESS TO EMBRACE DANGEROUS CONSPIRACIES THAT ATTACK THE VERY CORE PREMISE OF OUR NATION. THAT LAWFUL ELECTIONS REVIEWED BY THE COURTS WHEN NECESSARY AND CERTIFIED BY THE STATES AND ELECTORAL COLLEGE DETERMINE WHO SERVES AS PRESIDENT. IF WE DO NOT CONDEMN THE CONSPIRACIES AND THE LIES, IF WE DO NOT HOLD THOSE RESPONSIBLE TO ACCOUNT, WE WILL BE EXCUSING THIS CONDUCT AND IT WILL BECOME A FEATURE OF ALL ELECTIONS.

 AMERICA WILL NEVER BE THE SAME . 

TODAY AS WE MEET HERE, THERE ARE REPUBLICAN CANDIDATES FOR GOVERNOR WHO DENY THE OUTCOME OF THE 2020 ELECTION AND WHO MAY REFUSE TO CERTIFY FUTURE ELECTIONS IF THEY OPPOSE THE RESULTS. 

WE HAVE CANDIDATES FOR SECRETARY OF STATE WHO MAY REFUSE TO REPORT THE ACTUAL RESULTS OF THE POPULAR VOTE IN FUTURE ELECTIONS. 

AND WE HAVE CANDIDATES FOR CONGRESS INCLUDING HERE IN WYOMING, WHO REFUSED TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT JOE BIDEN WON THE 2020 ELECTION AND SUGGESTED STATES DECERTIFY THEIR RESULTS. 

OUR NATION IS BARRELING ONCE AGAIN TOWARDS CRISIS, LAWLESSNESS, AND VIOLENCE! NO AMERICAN SHOULD SUPPORT ELECTION DENIERS FOR ANY POSITION OF GENUINE RESPONSIBILITY WHERE THEIR REFUSAL TO FOLLOW THE RULE OF LAW WILL CORRUPT OUR FUTURE!

OUR NATION IS YOUNG IN THE HISTORY OF MANKIND AND YET WE'RE THE OLDEST DEMOCRACY IN THE WORLD. OUR SURVIVAL IS NOT GUARANTEED. HISTORY HAS SHOWN US OVER AND OVER AGAIN HOW POISONOUS LIES DESTROY FREE NATIONS. 

OVER THE LAST SEVERAL MONTHS, IN THE JANUARY SIX HEARINGS, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE HAVE WATCHED DOZENS OF REPUBLICANS, INCLUDING THE MOST SENIOR OFFICIALS WORKING FOR PRESIDENT TRUMP IN THE WHITE HOUSE, THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT AND ON HIS CAMPAIGN. PEOPLE WHO SERVED PRESIDENT TRUMP LOYALLY TESTIFY THAT THEY TOLD HIM THE ELECTION WAS NOT STOLEN OR  RIGGED AND THAT THERE WAS NO MASSIVE FRAUD. THAT'S  WHY PRESIDENT TRUMP AND OTHERS INVENT EXCUSES AND PRETEXTS FOR PEOPLE NOT TO WATCH THE HEARINGS AT ALL,

BUT NO CITIZEN OF THIS REPUBLIC IS A BYSTANDER.

ALL OF US HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO UNDERSTAND WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. WE CANNOT ABANDON THE TRUTH AND REMAIN A FREE NATION. 

TO BELIEVE DONALD TRUMP'S ELECTION LIES, YOU MUST BELIEVE THAT DOZENS OF FEDERAL AND STATE COURTS WHO RULED AGAINST HIM, INCLUDING MANY JUDGES HE APPOINTED, WERE ALL CORRUPTED AND BIASED. THAT ALL MANNER OF CRAZY CONSPIRACY THEORIES STOLE OUR ELECTION FROM US AND THAT DONALD TRUMP ACTUALLY REMAINS PRESIDENT TODAY. 

AS OF LAST WEEK, YOU MUST ALSO BELIEVE THAT 30 CAREER FBI AGENTS WHO HAVE SPENT THEIR LIVES WORKING TO SERVE OUR COUNTRY, ABANDONED THEIR HONOR AND THEIR OATHS AND WENT TO MAR A LAGO NOT TO PERFORM A LAWFUL SEARCH OR ADDRESS A NATIONAL SECURITY THREAT, BUT INSTEAD WITH A SECRET PLAN TO PLANT FAKE INCRIMINATING DOCUMENTS IN THE BOXES THEY SEIZED. THIS IS YET ANOTHER INSIDIOUS LIE.

DONALD TRUMP KNOWS THAT VOICING THESE CONSPIRACIES WILL PROVOKE VIOLENCE AND THREATS OF VIOLENCE. THIS HAPPENED ON JANUARY 6 AND IS NOW HAPPENING AGAIN. IT IS ENTIRELY FORESEEABLE THAT THE VIOLENCE WILL ESCALATE FURTHER. YET HE AND OTHERS CONTINUE PURPOSELY TO FEED THE DANGER . 


oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
TODAY OUR FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT IS BEING THREATENED. A FEDERAL JUDGE IS BEING THREATENED. FRESH THREATS OF VIOLENCE ARE ARISING EVERYWHERE AND DESPITE KNOWING ALL OF THIS, DONALD TRUMP RECENTLY RELEASED THE NAMES OF THE FBI AGENTS INVOLVED IN THE SEARCH.

THAT WAS PURPOSEFUL AND MALICIOUS. 

NO PATRIOTIC AMERICAN SHOULD EXCUSE THESE THREATS OR BE INTIMIDATED BY THEM. OUR GREAT NATION MUST NOT BE RULED BY A MOB PROVOKED OVER SOCIAL MEDIA.  OUR DUTY AS CITIZENS OF THIS REPUBLIC IS NOT ONLY TO DEFEND THE FREEDOM THAT'S BEEN HANDED DOWN TO US. WE ALSO HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO LEARN FROM THE ACTIONS OF THOSE WHO CAME BEFORE TO KNOW THE STORIES OF THE GRIT AND PERSEVERANCE OF THE BRAVE MEN AND WOMEN WHO BUILT AND SAVED THIS UNION. IN THE LIVES OF THESE GREAT AMERICANS, WE FIND INSPIRATION AND PURPOSE. 

IN MAY OF 1864 AFTER YEARS OF WAR AND A STRING OF RELUCTANT UNION GENERALS, ULYSSES S GRANT MET GENERAL LEE'S FORCES AT THE BATTLE OF THE WILDERNESS. IN TWO DAYS OF HEAVY FIGHTING, THE UNION SUFFERED OVER 17,000 CASUALTIES. AT THE END OF THAT BATTLE, GENERAL GRANT FACED A CHOICE,  MOST ASSUMED HE WOULD DO WHAT PREVIOUS UNION GENERALS HAD DONE AND RETREAT. ON THE EVENING OF MAY SEVENTH, GRANT BEGAN TO MOVE.  AS THE FIRES OF THE BATTLE STILL SMOLDERED, GRANT RODE TO THE HEAD OF THE COLUMN, HE RODE TO THE INTERSECTION OF BROCK ROAD AND ORANGE PLANK ROAD AND THERE AS THE MEN OF HIS ARMY WATCHED AND WAITED, INSTEAD OF TURNING NORTH BACK TOWARDS WASHINGTON AND SAFETY, GRANT TURNED HIS HORSE SOUTH TOWARD RICHMOND AND THE HEART OF LEE'S ARMY.   REFUSING TO RETREAT,  GRANT PRESSED ON TO VICTORY. 

LINCOLN AND GRANT AND ALL WHO FOUGHT IN OUR NATION'S TRAGIC CIVIL WAR, INCLUDING MY OWN GREAT GREAT GRANDFATHERS SAVED OUR UNION. THEIR COURAGE SAVED FREEDOM AND IF WE LISTEN CLOSELY, THEY ARE SPEAKING TO US DOWN THE GENERATIONS.  WE MUST NOT IDLY SQUANDER WHAT SO MANY HAVE FOUGHT AND DIED FOR.

 AMERICA HAS MEANT SO MUCH TO SO MANY BECAUSE WE ARE THE BEST HOPE OF FREEDOM ON EARTH. LAST WEEK, IN LARAMIE A GENTLEMAN CAME UP TO ME WITH TEARS IN HIS EYES. I'M NOT AN AMERICAN. HE SAID. BUT MY CHILDREN ARE, I GREW UP IN BRAZIL, I KNOW HOW FRAGILE FREEDOM IS AND WE MUST NOT LOSE IT HERE. 

A FEW DAYS AGO, HERE IN JACKSON, A WOMAN TOLD ME THAT HER GRANDPARENTS HAD SURVIVED AUSCHWITZ. THEY FOUND REFUGE IN AMERICA. SHE SAID SHE WAS AFRAID THAT SHE HAD NOWHERE TO GO IF FREEDOM DIED HERE. 

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, FREEDOM MUST NOT CANNOT AND WILL NOT DIE HERE.

WE MUST BE VERY CLEAR ABOUT THE THREAT WE FACE AND ABOUT WHAT IS REQUIRED TO DEFEAT IT. I HAVE SAID SINCE JANUARY 6 THAT I WILL DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO ENSURE DONALD TRUMP IS NEVER AGAIN ANYWHERE NEAR THE OVAL OFFICE. AND I MEAN IT. THIS IS A FIGHT FOR ALL OF US TOGETHER. 

I'M A CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICAN. I BELIEVE DEEPLY IN THE PRINCIPALS AND THE IDEALS ON WHICH MY PARTY WAS FOUNDED. I LOVE ITS HISTORY AND I LOVE WHAT OUR PARTY HAS STOOD FOR, BUT I LOVE MY COUNTRY MORE.

SO I ASK YOU TONIGHT TO JOIN ME AS WE LEAVE HERE, LET US RESOLVE THAT WE WILL STAND TOGETHER. REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS AND INDEPENDENTS AGAINST THOSE WHO WOULD DESTROY OUR REPUBLIC. THEY ARE ANGRY AND THEY ARE DETERMINED. BUT THEY HAVE NOT SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THE POWER OF AMERICANS, UNITED IN DEFENSE OF OUR CONSTITUTION AND COMMITTED TO THE CAUSE OF FREEDOM. THERE IS NO GREATER POWER ON THIS EARTH. AND WITH GOD'S HELP WE WILL PREVAIL. 



oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
Sidewalker
Sidewalker's avatar
Debates: 8
Posts: 2,669
3
2
5
Sidewalker's avatar
Sidewalker
3
2
5
-->
@oromagi
“America cannot remain free if we abandon the truth. The lie that the 2020 presidential election was stolen is insidious. It preys on those who love their country. It is a door Donald Trump opened to manipulate Americans to abandon their principles, to sacrifice their freedom, to justify violence, to ignore the rulings of our courts and the rule of law.” - Liz  Cheney


ebuc
ebuc's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,920
3
2
4
ebuc's avatar
ebuc
3
2
4
-->
@oromagi
Dick Cheney --formerly Darth Vader, now tempered in his older age, by the outstanding integrity of his daughter Liz, ---,

Liz Cheney ---Princess Lela's  3rd cousin removed, who also has moral integrity----,

Trumpet ---false prophet { gangster mentality } of liberty  for the seemingly oppressed{?}, and mostly white underdogs---,

Biden ---season { well rounded } politician arrives to top office position at age 78, a year older than then when senile Regan leaves office---,

Harris ---struggling to find her inner charisma and political charm---,

Amy Klobuchar ------............?...............-------,

Gretchen Whitmer --->>>>> ? >>>>>>---------,

Elisabeth Warren ---<<<<<< ? <<<<<<--------,

Gavin Newsom ------******* ? ********---,

Michel Obama -----------------? ---------------.

3RU7AL
3RU7AL's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 14,582
3
4
9
3RU7AL's avatar
3RU7AL
3
4
9
-->
@oromagi
Liz Cheney famously broke with her family in 2013 by opposing gay marriage ahead of a failed Senate bid. Her objections caused a rift with her sister, Mary, a married lesbian. Mary's spouse, Heather Poe, posted on Facebook that year that Cheney's position was offensive and that “I always thought freedom meant freedom for EVERYONE.”
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 574
Posts: 19,931
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
Allcaps eyesore
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@3RU7AL
-->@oromagi
Liz Cheney famously broke with her family in 2013 by opposing gay marriage ahead of a failed Senate bid. Her objections caused a rift with her sister, Mary, a married lesbian. Mary's spouse, Heather Poe, posted on Facebook that year that Cheney's position was offensive and that “I always thought freedom meant freedom for EVERYONE.”
Yeah, well, that's democracy for you.  Of course, I've been voting and sometimes campaigning for  Democratic candidates who opposed gay marriage my whole life.  2016 was the first presidential race with a pro gay marriage candidate and she had run in 2008 opposed to the notion.   I remember marching on my state's Democratic victory party when Bill Clinton was elected because Amendment 2 had passed in Colorado and we thought it unfair for Democrats to celebrating even as a law denying gays any legal protection passed.

LGBT folks learned long ago you don't have the luxury of demanding ideological purity when you're trying to build a coalition.  You rank your priorities and then you build on number one, maybe number two if you're lucky.

I blame Dick Cheney for deliberately provoking the Gulf War, manufacturing a racist casus belli for the Iraq War, and tyrannically destroying the investigators who uncovered him.  Dick Cheney's last heart attack is about forty years overdue as far as I'm concerned.  But he's right when he says that Trump's the worst threat America has ever faced.

Citizens of a democracy have to know the difference between enemies of the state  and the loyal opposition.  Saving democracy takes priority over gay marriage because its inclusive.   LGBT rights is just too easy an exploit for any autocrat to ignore (especially the gay ones).  Cheney and I and loyal Americans and lovers of democracy worldwide need to get together on Trump now.  Trump and his supporters are not pro-democracy and by that single attribute universally disqualified for office in any democracy. 
3RU7AL
3RU7AL's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 14,582
3
4
9
3RU7AL's avatar
3RU7AL
3
4
9
-->
@oromagi
Trump and his supporters are not pro-democracy and by that single attribute universally disqualified for office in any democracy. 
please explain
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@3RU7AL
Not sure what you're confused about.

people who don't believe in the success or worth of any project tend to work towards the manifestation of those beliefs. 
Therefore people who don't believe in the success or worth of any project make objectively poor leaders for that project if success is the ultimate goal
3RU7AL
3RU7AL's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 14,582
3
4
9
3RU7AL's avatar
3RU7AL
3
4
9
-->
@oromagi
Not sure what you're confused about.

people who don't believe in the success or worth of any project tend to work towards the manifestation of those beliefs. 
Therefore people who don't believe in the success or worth of any project make objectively poor leaders for that project if success is the ultimate goal
what leads you to the conclusion that "Trump and his supporters are not pro-democracy"

and furthermore,

what leads you to the conclusion that "by that single attribute universally disqualified for office in any democracy"

this claim appears to be "anti-democratic"
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@3RU7AL
what leads you to the conclusion that "Trump and his supporters are not pro-democracy"
That's the number one topic in American politics for the last seven years.  Are you really so unfamiliar with the evidence?

this claim appears to be "anti-democratic"
Nonsense.  Atheists make bad popes.  Liberals make bad kings.  Autocrats make bad elected officials.  Before you can effectively run any enterprise, you have to believe that enterprise is worth running.


3RU7AL
3RU7AL's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 14,582
3
4
9
3RU7AL's avatar
3RU7AL
3
4
9
-->
@oromagi
"by that single attribute universally disqualified for office in any democracy"
how do you propose we exclude these people from the democratic process ?
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@3RU7AL
-->@oromagi
"by that single attribute universally disqualified for office in any democracy"
how do you propose we exclude these people from the democratic process ?
The answer would have been obvious to anybody who is pro-democracy:  vote the motherfuckers down
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
DEMOCRATS HOLD 4 POINT LEAD over REPUBLICANS on GENERIC CONGRESSOINAL BALLOT: POLL
BY CAROLINE VAKIL - 08/17/22 3:31 PM ET

Democrats are leading Republicans by 4 percentage points on a generic congressional ballot, according to a new poll.

A Politico-Morning Consult poll released Wednesday found 46 percent of registered voters would choose the Democratic candidate compared to 42 percent who would choose the Republican if the election for Congress was held in their district today.

Twelve percent either said they did not know or had no opinion. 

The poll is the latest showing Democrats just outpacing their Republican counterparts on a generic congressional ballot. Another recent survey showed more respondents supporting the Democratic Party controlling Congress than the Republican Party.

The Politico-Morning Consult poll also shows that 42 percent of respondents approve of President Biden’s job as president, up 3 percentage points from a poll that Politico and Morning Consult released last week.

Democrats are expected to encounter several headwinds in November, including the president’s still-underwater approval ratings, inflation and the precedent that a first-term president’s party usually suffers some losses in the midterms.

But Democrats have some reasons to feel optimistic, too. Biden signed a sweeping climate, tax reform and health bill on Tuesday after Democrats passed the reconciliation package in Congress. It was considered a major feat for the party given previous failed attempts to pass a social spending bill. 

Recent data has also shown inflation has started to cool off, though it’s unclear if the trend will continue. A July jobs report that outpaced economists’ expectations is also considered a boost for Democrats.

The Politico-Morning Consult poll was conducted between Aug. 12 and Aug. 14 with 2,005 registered voters. The margin of error is plus or minus 2 percentage points.
VOTE them motherfuckers down!

3RU7AL
3RU7AL's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 14,582
3
4
9
3RU7AL's avatar
3RU7AL
3
4
9
-->
@oromagi
The answer would have been obvious to anybody who is pro-democracy:  vote the motherfuckers down
ok, it seemed like you were trying to find some other way of disqualifying them

have you considered proposals for fully transparent and fully auditable voting systems that protect individual voter identification data ?
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@3RU7AL
ok, it seemed like you were trying to find some other way of disqualifying them
So you just skipped past all that talk about coalition-building, I guess?

have you considered proposals for fully transparent and fully auditable voting systems that protect individual voter identification data ?
Well, we certainly had the most transparent and most audited election in US history in 2020.   

Here in Colorado I get my ballot in the mail a month before the election and I can track its progress by barcode through the counting process and then see the scanned copy of my vote on file any time I like for seven years via the same app that documents my state licenses, vax records, etc. City elections are now done entirely by mail.  Its super simple, much cheaper, participation is way up and we have high confidence in the accuracy of our votes.
ADreamOfLiberty
ADreamOfLiberty's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 4,171
3
2
2
ADreamOfLiberty's avatar
ADreamOfLiberty
3
2
2
-->
@3RU7AL
@oromagi
oromagi: Well, we certainly had the most transparent and most audited election in US history in 2020.   
The first step is admitting there is a problem. Nobody ever built a house if they already lived in an illusion-house.


Here in Colorado I get my ballot in the mail a month before the election and I can track its progress by barcode through the counting process and then see the scanned copy of my vote on file any time I like for seven years via the same app that documents my state licenses, vax records, etc.
Are you claiming you can lookup your ballot at any time you wish? See who you voted for?


and we have high confidence in the accuracy of our votes.
No, you have high confidence in the accuracy of the vote because that fits your narrative. The pro-democracy crowd care about reality not your contentment.
ILikePie5
ILikePie5's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 15,167
3
7
10
ILikePie5's avatar
ILikePie5
3
7
10
-->
@Greyparrot
Imagine how entitled you have to be to essentially call the people that voted you in liars and then relying on Democrats to even get you to 20%
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 25,989
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@ILikePie5
She was just a useful idiot, as defined in the OP.

19 days later

Lair77
Lair77's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 97
0
1
4
Lair77's avatar
Lair77
0
1
4
The Trump-style Republican that wants to turn the US into a corrupt banana republic and personality cult is bad.

But the Cheney-style of Republican that wants to indefinitely fight wars in the middle-east is no better.

Shila
Shila's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 3,006
3
3
5
Shila's avatar
Shila
3
3
5
-->
@Lair77
The Trump-style Republican that wants to turn the US into a corrupt banana republic and personality cult is bad.

But the Cheney-style of Republican that wants to indefinitely fight wars in the middle-east is no better.
It might be in the interest of all Americans to keep the two Trump and Cheney apart for obvious reasons.

Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
If Trump isn't running for anything how are they supposed to defeat him? 
Shila
Shila's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 3,006
3
3
5
Shila's avatar
Shila
3
3
5
If Trump wins after promising to give pardons to all those who broke the law. Then we know his supporters are law breakers. Should Trump lose then he and his supporters should all go to jail because no pardons were given.
oromagi
oromagi's avatar
Debates: 117
Posts: 8,696
8
10
11
oromagi's avatar
oromagi
8
10
11
-->
@Polytheist-Witch
If Trump isn't running for anything how are they supposed to defeat him? 

I think Trump almost has to run for President again at this point.  It is his best argument against going to jail
Shila
Shila's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 3,006
3
3
5
Shila's avatar
Shila
3
3
5
-->
@oromagi
--> @Polytheist-Witch
If Trump isn't running for anything how are they supposed to defeat him? 

I think Trump almost has to run for President again at this point.  It is his best argument against going to jail
Trump’s supporters will be confused when they hear chants “lock him up” before the elections.