1984 is a warning, not a how-to guide.
Gaslighting
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57
"Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. Both words are normally used in so vague a way that any definition is liable to be challenged, but one must draw a distinction between them, since two different and even opposing ideas are involved. By ‘patriotism’ I mean devotion to a particular place and a particular way of life, which one believes to be the best in the world but has no wish to force on other people. Patriotism is of its nature defensive, both militarily and culturally. Nationalism, on the other hand, is inseparable from the desire for power. The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality."
-George Orwell
Everybody can be defensive when their ancestors were nationalist imperialists to secure the land prior to them. ;)
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@RationalMadman
Even if you personally like Biden, the altering of official transcripts isn't something you want out of an Orwellian government.
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@Greyparrot
I don't personally like Biden at all, the guy is a fucking shame and is too right-wing to even claim he's left-wing in any department.
I am confused why that guy became a Democrat.
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@Greyparrot
I don't see any gaslighting, I see a man riddled with dementia reading his transcripter too literally when he says 'end of quote, repeat the line'.
And/or or or is hardly a malicious alteration. It was probably an idea for them to gramatically correct a quote that did have an error in limiting to 'or'.
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@RationalMadman
It was probably an idea for them to gramatically correct a quote that did have an error in limiting to 'or'.
They were not grammatically correcting a quote. They were correcting the record of a President in an official WH transcript. The people demand and deserve truth. Not political gaslighting of reality into some fake reality.
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@Greyparrot
Why is it that people who are right-wing tend to use the term gaslight very wrong? I've noticed this with Lunatic on here and others elsewhere.
Gaslighting is not just about rephrasing something, it's about making people think they are insane. Gaslighting could be, for instance, how they keep telling us 'he isn't showing signs of dementia' when moments like 'end of quote, repeat the line' being said out loud blatantly imply it.
What you call gaslighting is the part that isn't, you're reacting strongly to the part that's less important, 'or' or 'and/or' is hardly the focus.
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@RationalMadman
gaslight very wrong?
Rewriting history is gaslighting. I am sorry but that is the definition of gaslighting. Especially when you are doing it to people who have a memory of what actually happened.
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@Greyparrot
saying or vs and/or is what you classify as 'gaslighting'?
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@RationalMadman
Maybe he's a democrat because he's a supporter of democracy.
Though one would hope that all Americans support democracy.
Especially after Trumpets brief fascist excursion.
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@zedvictor4
The way Trump dominated votes is very similar to how shitstain Boris Johnson did AKA winning seats while losing the 'popular' vote and dominating primarily due to people sitting home and not voting.
The apathy that the seat system brings is even rational, not just emotional. Nobody likes knowing their vote means fuck all of their vote isn't for the winner of their local area.
Calling it 'democracy' to not have a pluralistic vote or proportional representation in this day and age is an absolute joke.
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@RationalMadman
I wouldn't disagree with that.
Though I must admit that I am apolitical or too moderate to align myself with any of our major parties.
Consequently I haven't voted in a general election or local elections for years.
I did vote to remain in Europe, simply because coming out seemed an unnecessary faff.
And it was and still is a faff.
PR for sure.
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@zedvictor4
I did vote to remain in Europe, simply because coming out seemed an unnecessary faff.
Who coulda thought in 1940 that all Germany had to send over was the promise of Euro dollars instead of planes to conquer the UK?
Calling it 'democracy' to not have a pluralistic vote or proportional representation in this day and age is an absolute joke.
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@oromagi
"Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. Both words are normally used in so vague a way that any definition is liable to be challenged, but one must draw a distinction between them, since two different and even opposing ideas are involved. By ‘patriotism’ I mean devotion to a particular place and a particular way of life, which one believes to be the best in the world but has no wish to force on other people. Patriotism is of its nature defensive, both militarily and culturally. Nationalism, on the other hand, is inseparable from the desire for power. The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality."-George Orwell
I, for one, am shocked that the guy who fought against the Nationalists (the good guys) in the Spanish Civil War would oppose nationalism!
Even in his critique of nationalism, he doesn't seem to do a very good job. I do desire for my country to have more power and prestige and think that an atomized individualism is toxic.
Although, I do appreciate your public service in showing that this old democratic socialist is not conservatives' best friend. Outside of two good books critiquing authoritarianism, he has little to be praised for by conservatives.
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@bmdrocks21
Outside of two good books critiquing authoritarianism, he has little to be praised for by conservatives.
Agree. It's just that he is taken more seriously by fellow leftists when he exposes authoritarian leftist ideologies through satire.
Seriously as in conflating satire for a mission statement.
12 days later
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@ILikePie5
Yellen is now redefining a recession to be something other than 2 consecutive quarters of GDP decline.
Full Gaslight.
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@Greyparrot
Yellen is now redefining a recession to be something other than 2 consecutive quarters of GDP decline.Full Gaslight.
It’s nothing new for liberals. They have been denying simple economics with their socialist policies for years now
It’s nothing new for liberals. They have been denying simple economics with their socialist policies for years now
Oh.. like purposefully devaluing the petro-dollar as a way to end oil then claiming it's a "global problem?"
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@Greyparrot
Yellen is now redefining a recession to be something other than 2 consecutive quarters of GDP decline.
They had no problem calling it a recession when governments were commanding stores, bars, restaurants, arenas, etc. to close and for citizens to stay home. Just like any other recession, right?
CNN's Kasie Hunt and Chris Cillizza discussed on Monday morning how the Biden administration is fudging the definition of whether the U.S. is technically in a recession ahead of the midterm elections.
"In my view, I should be drafted into the NBA," Cillizza joked. "NBA executives didn't agree with that."
"You don't get to change the nomenclature in the middle of a campaign because it doesn't work for you," Cillizza said.
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@RationalMadman
I am still not sure why the administration is still spending so much propaganda redefining what a recession is instead of actually helping people.
The people demand and deserve truth. Not political gaslighting of reality into some fake reality.
It's so amusing to see people whine about redefining "recession" while shrugging off Trump's completely ridiculous, made-up and PRE DETERMINED baldfaced election lies that he continues to assert smugly (even after January 6) despite having no good evidence, no backing by his highest ranking political allies or even family members for that matter, and no theories that haven't been disproven at every single level through internal and external investigations, vote recounts in every challenged state, and dozens of failed court appeals across the country. Where are the threads about that gaslighting?
Like how can ya'll sit there and pretend to give a shit about political games while endorsing a lying, power hungry douchebag? Have a little shame. Have a little self decency instead of making yourselves look like a bunch of bootlicking shmucks. Even Fox News acknowledges that Trump continues to assert brazen falsehoods with no factual basis at all, and we know political candidates have made siding with Trump's big lie essentially their #1 campaign strategy despite being a totally fabricated untruth. We're just going to pretend like that's not problematic? Oh okay. Sheesh. Let's just empower nothing but people who deny reality and refuse to accept the outcome of elections if they are not victorious - what could possibly go wrong?
Gee... it's almost as if the brazen and blatant gaslighting of tens of millions of people across the country isn't actually that dangerous. It almost seems like repeatedly lying and making false claims isn't immoral and is actually good for the country! Golly, It's actually not a big deal at all! I guess gaslighting is only problematic if Democrats do it, duh. I mean who cares if Trump completely denies all aspects of objective, provable reality and continues to brainwash scared and struggling poor people to profess their diehard allegiance to him above all and denounce all other aspects of U.S. government and institutions that don't validate his lies? NBD. That's patriotism. I get it now.
I am still not sure why the administration is still spending so much propaganda redefining what a recession is instead of actually helping people.
How is the government supposed to help people? They've already called for more oil drilling, although people succumbing to ridiculous lies that oil companies have decided to significantly raise prices at a given point in time just because they're suddenly "uncertain about their future" is one of the most amusing things to witness. They've done this over and over throughout history and people fall for it every single time despite being the biggest, richest and most powerful oligopoly on planet Earth lol. That's great PR for you.
We are decades or more away from going green and lobbyists will continue to fight it every single step of the way. Big Oil is still one of the most significant and in-demand industries on the planet, and that won't change anytime soon (which ironically, conservatives keep pointing out but then fall victim to the convenient messaging that Big Oil is just trying to tighten their belts and gauge people because of Democrats and because they're scared they won't survive which is why they need to keep posting record profits... LOL okay... sure Jan). Poor little oil tycoons. Won't somebody think about the oil tycoons?
They've already called for more oil drilling,
While keeping all regulations in place.
The biggest, richest and most powerful oligopoly
Most oil drilling is done by small independent outfits, but you already knew that.
We are decades or more away from going green and lobbyists will continue to fight it every single step of the way
Don't the people get a say in that? Or is this just big green oligarchs vs fossil oligarchs playing commerce games to fuck with our 401K's?
Won't somebody think about the oil tycoons?
Funny how all those coal plants keep getting turned back own when brownouts mean the loss of power to control the lives of the little guy.
LOL okay... sure Jan)
There used to be a time when countries just started wars to enforce with brutal violence wealth inequality, now they can just fabricate an end of the world lie.
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@Greyparrot
While keeping all regulations in place.
Every legal business is regulated. Which drilling regulations should be done away with?
Most oil drilling is done by small independent outfits
Don't be daft. Still a ton of price fixing in the oil industry.
Oil rigs could drill more now if they wanted to. They currently lack the supplies, the manpower and the will to invest given how volatile oil markets can be. They just took a massive hit during the pandemic (that they've colluded to rectify with production limits). Pretending that Democrats can fix this by simply demanding they produce more or by conceding to idiotic climate change deniers and lobbyists to ensure Big Oil remains on top is not a good solution.
The libertarian in me wants no part of government investing in a bunch of initiatives that will inevitably exploit taxpayers, even if it means a shift away from the energy sector of the 1800s I'm hoping to see sooner rather than later. But the pragmatist in me thinks the GOP is doing a massive disservice to their constituents by lying to them about global warming, and pretending that remaining in the dark ages is somehow in their financial best interest just because they happen to work for a coal company. The entire country should't be beholden to the financial interests of a few thousand miners in West Virginia who barely make enough to scrape by with their current jobs as it is. Capitalism should be about evolution and trying to improve the status quo, not holding onto it for dear life by using lies to scare people into clinging on to their shitty quality of life they're afraid is being threatened while they get left behind.