I believe everything is true and i can fully make sense of that. Think marvel universe (one part of my religious text)... i can make it all make sense, but why are we so unwilling to compromise for this belief... imho, the tru spiritual belief. To set aside what i want everyone else should be... is so easy for me. I enjoy what you are, without it effecting who i am.
How do you know wat's tru?
Posts
Total:
29
I could be very graphic here to illustrate how dangerous it can be when people become incapable of determining what is and isn't true/real.
Instead, I'll keep it stern and clean.
If you don't know what's true and what isn't true, you could end up eating what you think is breakfast cereal but is actually porridge. It starts that simple and that harmless with some severe cases of dementia, when the 'tip over the edge' begins. If we mean schizophrenia, perhaps the person either hallucinates something or has paranoid delusions (catatonic is the other form but not so relevant to this). If you don't know what's true, your life can become a crippling even life-ending series of events or singular catastrophic event.
The way we go about determining what's true, since we are animals whether we like it or not, is based around surviving as a creature. From childhood our parents or whatever authoritative guardians took care of us, gave us some 'lay of the land' if we mean moral and basic, fundamental truths. This is why letting children being raised in cults or by abusive parents can have very long-lasting effects on their ability to feel that a good, sensible idea is true. It could be that they never can believe they are worth enough or never believe they aren't supposed to suffer every time they feel good, panicking about that good, safe feeling being ripped away from them.
It could be that you don't understand what's true about a chemical, so you search it on a search engine and ask experts and still don't trust them because you got scarred when you were younger by trusting some people in authority and think they're all out to get/dupe you. Everybody who was abused and misled when they were young, grow up with some troubles establishing what's true, healthy and good for them in adulthood. This is a clue about the core of determining truth for a healthy mind being more emotion-based than logic-based.
The reality is that if you don't trust a single scientist, a single authority etc. you will end up incapable of determining what's true beyond personal anecdotes. That is why our species, humans, are so far above and beyond all other species combined on Earth; we can communicate truths to others so they don't have to waste the time and effort discovering it themselves. The way we snowball truths and discoveries across generations is unparalleled but there does indeed come to be an issue when and if genuine cover-ups, lies and conspiracies occur. Sometimes the paranoid are indeed the right ones and the easily trusting get duped.
The fact is you never ever, no matter how astute your mind, will 100% be able to separate truth from lies. Instead, you need an efficient framework to keep you sane and continually making sensible decisions. That's up to you to determine and decide, up to the point you become a significant danger to yourself and/or those close to you.
-->
@RationalMadman
Beautiful response. First i will respond to the professional.. as you say, pros are only pros to their reality and what they know. So they become moot in a sense. You are right tho, in the sense of, not knowing what point of truth i may be at. I don't know. I may feel enlightened, but i may also be ground level.
I have sort of accounted for that in my spiritual beliefs. The hard part of predicting infinity. But in any way i look it at, it comes back to the individual. Some individuals, "in our definitions", have it easy or hard. But i think we all knew, in a sense, what we're doing. So... we may be animals in the sense of survivial, but we also transcend animals bc we can think. The question becomes more infinite in nature. It becomes more than what we are now... would you "eventually" or at any point "pick" this life to exist.
Given an infinite platform... this life existing seems like a no brainer to me, even if i don't like it. In a spiritual sense, what does that mean? I should ask myself why i would live in a life that i pick as less than ideal... well, this life has other pros right... so even i may pick it out of infinite choices... eventually. Even if i'm here once in billions of billioins of years... this life exists.
To me, it all comes down to the logic of something a comic book writer would write...why do i exist? Bc you fit into the narrative? That should humble us
-->
@Outplayz
Everything is real within a context, therefore everything is true within a context.
Basically the conversion of incoming signals into understandable data and the manipulation thereof, resulting in whatever one chooses to reconstruct, and perhaps output.
x 7.9 billion approx.
-->
@Outplayz
I think this is basically imagination anyway, anything could be true. And what is true can change in an instant.
-->
@Outplayz
OplazyI....I believe everything is true
Everything that exists ---i.e. occupied space and non-occupied space--- is true.
There exists absolute truths and relative truths
J6 ...anything could be true.
Sorry J6, but that is not true, if inviolate cosmic principles and physical laws exist. They do exist because that is what any finite existence requires, integrity. Integrity exists, even if it s for ultra-short periods of time. Ex a meson ---i.e. bosonic force particle composed of two quarks---- exist for very short periods of time between its exchange between two heavy particles -ex protons and neutrons in the atom---.
I.e. for that short period of time a finite pattern of existence occurs as an occupied space.
Polka dot unicorns exist in coloring book space and virtual reality space. They do not exist as biologic pattern as an occupied space.
Polka dot unicorns exist as concepts ergo Meta-space. Meta{ greek } = beyond. Beyond occupied and non-occupied space exists mind/intellect/concepts.
-->
@Outplayz
I believe everything is true and i can fully make sense of that. Think marvel universe (one part of my religious text)... i can make it all make sense, but why are we so unwilling to compromise for this belief... imho, the tru spiritual belief. To set aside what i want everyone else should be... is so easy for me. I enjoy what you are, without it effecting who i am.
i was about to respond to this with a definition of truth
but then i noticed it was you
-->
@Outplayz
Logic demands that at least half of all possible statements are false, because no two contradictory statements can be true at the same time. For this reason, you have to decide for every statement if you want to believe whats being said or its opposite, also called rejecting a statement. You should also remember that other people won't accept as true what you believe without evidence and most probably most of your ideas are useless for practicall purposes.
Truth in science is usefull and evidence based. Philosophy is useless but also a fine lesson in logical argumentation and thinking.
Spirituality is akin to imaginary friends. Even if true, since they don't do anything measureable or usefull, ignoring them is the most rational option.
-->
@Outplayz
You weren't a member of the Branch Davidians, Church Universal and Triumphant, the Church of Satan, the Movement for the Restoration of the Ten Commandments, the Peoples Temple, Heaven's Gate, and the Unification Church , were you?
-->
@ebuc
I would love to agree, but I can't anymore.
-->
@Benjamin
Spirituality is akin to imaginary friends. Even if true, since they don't do anything measureable or usefull, ignoring them is the most rational option.
Fables should be taught as fables, myths as myths, and miracles as poetic fantasies. To teach superstitions as truths is a most terrible thing. The child mind accepts and believes them, and only through great pain and perhaps tragedy can he be in after years relieved of them.
Hypatia
Hypatia
-->
@janesix
I would love to agree, but I can't anymore
And this is evidence of your ability to access Meta-space { mind/intellect/concept }.
Humans seek truth and find relative and absolute truths as well as faleshoods and false narratives.
Keep in mind, the false narratives can be mixed in with truths and be intentional, or unintentional, and this is where we find the introduction of morality , that, is only found with humans.
Morality { Meta-space } exists for most humans.
1} objectively harvest information, ---physical bits and Meta-space bits---
2} sort the information into various patterns and catagorie's truth and non-truth,
3} winnow out cosmic principles,
4} subjectively apply those principles to advance our standard of living, morals and in support of the integrity we call environment/Universe.
Come to grips that all pattern integrity's are is terminal, irrepsective of their lifetime, they disintegrate. Does finite occupied space Universe disintegrate? Yes, and reformulates itself { reborn } into its next phase of existence, with the same inviolate physical laws and cosmic principles.
General Relatively, when followed to its extreme, says that all EMRadiation must come to the end of spacetime in black holes and the Universe itself. I dont believe GR is true in that extremme. That would be in violation of the human arrived at principle, ....naught is created nor destroyed, only transformed....
Belief can be a placebo effect, and that is all fine and well, however, belief alone does not make the belief a relative truth or an absolute truth.
Fairy tales marvel super-heroe's is all part of the human narrative of three primary kinds of narrative mentioned above.
-->
@Benjamin
because no two contradictory statements can be true at the same time.
two contradictory statements can be false at the same time
two contradictory statements can be true at different times
two contradictory statements can be unfalsifiable at the same time
-->
@3RU7AL
two contradictory statements can be false at the same time
Nope. The logical definition of contradictory statements is that they have opposite truth values.
-->
@Benjamin
I remember a story about two ambitious yeshiva students arguing to an impasse.
They both agreed to settle their dispute by consulting a wise old rabbi.
The first student feverishly made their case to the wise old rabbi and the rabbi nodded thoughtfully and said, "you're right".
The second student, unfazed, stepped up and laid out their own argument, making sure not to skip over any critical points of doctrine, and when they had exhausted their rhetoric, the wise old rabbi nodded thoughtfully and said, "you're right".
Now the students couldn't fathom how both arguments could possibly be considered correct and implored the wise old rabbi for some sort of satisfactory explanation.
Well, it's rather simple really, the wise old rabbi began slowly, if you accept the first student's axioms, then their conclusions follow logically. And if you accept the second student's axioms, then their conclusions follow logically.
You two forgot to negotiate your axioms.
-->
@Benjamin
two contradictory statements can be false at the same timeNope. The logical definition of contradictory statements is that they have opposite truth values.
CLAIM (1) : YHWH IS THE ONE AND ONLY GOD
CLAIM (2) : AHURA MAZDA IS THE ONE AND ONLY GOD
IT IS QUITE POSSIBLE FOR BOTH CLAIMS TO BE FALSE
-->
@3RU7AL
CLAIM (1) : YHWH IS THE ONE AND ONLY GODCLAIM (2) : AHURA MAZDA IS THE ONE AND ONLY GOD
The second claim is CONTRARY, not contradictory to the first. That is, they can't both be true but either or both can be false. Here is a formal logical contradiction:
CLAIM (1) : YHWH IS THE ONE AND ONLY GOD
CLAIM (2) : YHWH IS NOT THE ONE AND ONLY GOD
The truth of either proves the other false, and vice versa. This is the formal definition of a logical contradiction.
-->
@Benjamin
CLAIM (1) : YHWH IS THE ONE AND ONLY GODCLAIM (2) : YHWH IS NOT THE ONE AND ONLY GODThe truth of either proves the other false, and vice versa. This is the formal definition of a logical contradiction.
both of these claims are unfalsifiable making it IMPOSSIBLE for either of them to be considered "true"
(IFF) the terms of your claim are UNDEFINED (THEN) your claim can NEVER be considered (EITHER) "true" (OR) "false"
YHWH = ???
GOD = ???
CLAIM (1) : BLINBLORT IS THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOPCLAIM (2) : BLINBLORT IS NOT THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOP
can you determine the "truth-value" of either one of these claims ?
with the information provided ?
-->
@3RU7AL
CLAIM (1) : BLINBLORT IS THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOPCLAIM (2) : BLINBLORT IS NOT THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOP
I can tell you with 100% certainty that one of these is true and the other false. Undefined terms doesn't allow the laws of logic to be broken. X =/= not X, no matter what X is.
-->
@Benjamin
CLAIM (1) : BLINBLORT IS THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOPCLAIM (2) : BLINBLORT IS NOT THE ONE AND ONLY FLORKLOPI can tell you with 100% certainty that one of these is true and the other false. Undefined terms doesn't allow the laws of logic to be broken. X =/= not X, no matter what X is.
THE IMPOSSIBILITY OF YOU KNOWING WHICH ONE IS "TRUE" MAKES THE DISTINCTION MEANINGLESS
NOT ALL CLAIMS CONTAIN "TRUTH-VALUE"
-->
@Benjamin
BLINBLORT = NOT
FLORKLOP = ONLY
-->
@Benjamin
I can tell you with 100% certainty that one of these is true and the other false. Undefined terms doesn't allow the laws of logic to be broken. X =/= not X, no matter what X is.
a nonsensical statement cannot be "true"
the negation of a nonsensical statement cannot be "true"
142 days later
-->
@Outplayz
How do you know what’s true?
Listen to the experts and stay with the facts.
28 days later
-->
@Benjamin
You should also remember that other people won't accept as true what you believe without evidence and most probably most of your ideas are useless for practicall purposes.
This is permissible in my belief. Whatever your truths are i believe for you. Believe me or not, it doesn't matter. The rest of what you said is of practicality. Sure, in this reality it's not very practical. Actually, science rules in this reality bc that is the most accurate measure of some-what truth. I'm sure it will keep advancing too. But it's always the study of this reality. I'm talking about the "what if" ... what is the next reality, if it is so? That reality is my reality bc the viewer would be me, the person experiencing would be me... therefore, it becomes another one of my truths. Hard to explain, but ya..
-->
@3RU7AL
i was about to respond to this with a definition of truthbut then i noticed it was you
Lol, don't hold back my guy. I've been super busy with my new reality of "making money" and being of this world... but i try and check back when i can. Your arguments are almost always profound. Take me back to my drawing board... i love that feeling
-->
@janesix
I think this is basically imagination anyway, anything could be true. And what is true can change in an instant.
What is the implication that imagination is true in a seemingly infinite platform? How many ways can it manifest? I find that fascinating.
-->
@FLRW
So what??? those memberships are comprised of humans that literally are bones and flesh filled with crap... they're human.. i don't care if they give themselves special group names.
-->
@Shila
Listen to the experts and stay with the facts.
Experts are just humans. I do follow what they say, i actually love them. They are infinitely smarter than i am in what they do. They are the god-npc's of what they do. They are the perfect characters of a mage in this world discovering the awesomeness of this world. I'm not what they are, however, i get them. So far... none of them contradict my belief with other than... "your head is in the clouds of fantasy" ... and i agree with them. My head is in fantasy. But again... fantasy exists in a seemingly infinite platform. How many ways can that manifest? Experts are also humble enough to say they don't know. I'm just slightly defining that unknown. Not saying it's fact, but saying it makes sense "if so it manifests in the way i think" .. Def. a hard thing to disprove since i'm basically saying dreams manifest in a possible world that is not this world but the next. I'm fully aware of myself being speculative, but it just makes sense to me.
-->
@Outplayz
--> @3RU7ALi was about to respond to this with a definition of truthbut then i noticed it was youLol, don't hold back my guy. I've been super busy with my new reality of "making money" and being of this world... but i try and check back when i can. Your arguments are almost always profound. Take me back to my drawing board... i love that feeling
Making money and being of this world, Why is that a new reality? That is as materialistic as it can get.