where did muhammad brought the stories in the quran ,copyright infringement/plagiarism

Author: Lunar108
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Lunar108
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If you looked at the stories mentioned in the holy quran you'll find that most of them if not all of them came from both the bible and the talmud with few edits here and there to make them seem different .
The cause of that is muhammad went every year with merchant caravan together with Waraqah Ibn Nawfal which is the maternal uncle of Muhammad via Khadijah, Muhammad's first wife. His presence in the story of Muhammad is so problematic. Most people who believe in Islam never heard about him. Those few who did, are just given a "quick" passing by mentioning in their Islamic classes. Yet, even by Islamic standards, he was a very important figure. Some see him as the first person to believe in Muhammad even before the first message had arrived.
Who is this man? Waraqah was a priest in Christianity and Judaism. He is Nestorian priest. Waraqah lived a long life and died of old age shortly after Muhammad got his first message also muhammad went with him as he would go with merchant caravan.
His story throws big concerns to the claim that Muhammad's message came from Allah or via his angel Gabriel - especially when Islam ended up near carbon copy of Nestorian faith (a mixture of Christianity and Judaism). It shows Muhammad had access to the knowledge. On top of that it shows even more that the Kuffar of Mecca tolerated all faiths, including having a priest among their ranks (Waraqah would have been a Quraishi). It proves what Islamic text sort of admit, that the Kabaa was open liberal place for all people to practice whatever faith they have in peace by the fact many gods were allowed on display. It proves that the Kuffar never harmed those who did not follow their gods. Khadijah, a very successful business women in her own right, was a monotheist and most probably Christian Nestorian like her uncle - some Islamic scholars may disagree this shows the feminist view of those Kuffar and place any nonsense about how women were treated back then into the trash -like islamic claims of women being oppressed back then- .
When did the people of Mecca have issues with Muhammad? When Muhammad started to insult their gods, when they would wake up in the morning and find the statues of the gods dessicated and damaged, when Muhammad mock them that their gods are useless! Talk about tolerance??
But for me, this hadith throws the doors wide open on the story of Waraqah. The hadith suggest that shortly after Muhammad started getting the revelations "....But a short while later Waraqa died and the Divine Inspiration was paused (stopped) for a while so that Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) was very much grieved." Sahih al-Bukhari 4953
This proves Muhammad knew the man very well, and likely behind his inspiration!
islam plagiarized stories from Christianity and Judaism  
here is few that are mentioned in both the quran and the talmud/torah :
  • Gideon/Saul (Tālūt)
  • Saul, David and Goliath (Tālūt, Dāwūd and Jalut)
  • The Queen of Sheba
  • Jonah (Yūnus) and the big fish
  • Haman
here is few stories that are mentioned in both the bible and the quran :
  • Zechariah (Zakariya) and John (Yahya)
  • Mary (Maryam)
  • Jesus (ʿIsa, Yeshuaʿ)
  • Moses (Mosa)
  • Abraham (ibraham)
  • Lot (Lut)
  • AntiChrist
  • Adam and Eve
  • Noah the ark and the flood



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Yassine
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@Lunar108
If you looked at the stories mentioned in the holy quran you'll find that most of them if not all of them came from both the bible and the talmud with few edits here and there to make them seem different .
- About 6% of the stories do indeed have parallels in the Bible. Another half have parallels in Biblical Apocrypha, the Talmud, Zoroastrian traditions & Arab pagan traditions, few in the Vedas, plus some ancient Sumerian & Egyptian sources. The rest of the stories & the rest of the Quran has nothing to do with all of that.


The cause of that is muhammad went every year with merchant caravan together with Waraqah Ibn Nawfal which is the maternal uncle of Muhammad via Khadijah, Muhammad's first wife.
- Never happened, & he wasn't his maternal uncle! They belonged to the same tribe though. 


His presence in the story of Muhammad is so problematic. Most people who believe in Islam never heard about him. Those few who did, are just given a "quick" passing by mentioning in their Islamic classes. Yet, even by Islamic standards, he was a very important figure. Some see him as the first person to believe in Muhammad even before the first message had arrived.
- None of this is true. Waraqa appears very briefly in the story. Khadija calls for him when the Prophet (pbuh) tells her about what he saw at the cave, for she knows he studied scripture & wrote down prayers. He dies shortly after -with the only revealed Quran is the 96th Surah (Alaq), which has nothing to do with any Biblical or other tradition! 


Who is this man? Waraqah was a priest in Christianity and Judaism. He is Nestorian priest. Waraqah lived a long life and died of old age shortly after Muhammad got his first message also muhammad went with him as he would go with merchant caravan.
- Waraqa was not a priest, there were none in Mecca. He was Hanifi (follower of Abraham's religion inherited from Ismail). Though he met a Nestorian priest in his journey to Iraq. Plus, there is no such thing as priest in Christianity & Judaism!!! Like WT*?! 


His story throws big concerns to the claim that Muhammad's message came from Allah or via his angel Gabriel - especially when Islam ended up near carbon copy of Nestorian faith (a mixture of Christianity and Judaism). It shows Muhammad had access to the knowledge.
- Waraqa died shortly after the first revelation. What knowledge? Even if we suppose Waraqa was the greatest Christian scholar of his time & did not die & was with the Prophet (pbuh) until death, this would explain probably 1% or 2% of the Quran. This stupid argument was first defended by John of Damascus 14 centuries ago. It has been discarded since with the advancement of modern Quranic studies & Biblical criticism in the West. Get updated.


On top of that it shows even more that the Kuffar of Mecca tolerated all faiths, including having a priest among their ranks (Waraqah would have been a Quraishi). It proves what Islamic text sort of admit, that the Kabaa was open liberal place for all people to practice whatever faith they have in peace by the fact many gods were allowed on display. It proves that the Kuffar never harmed those who did not follow their gods. 
- What part of 'polytheist' do you not understand? They were pagan polytheists. The Prophet (pbuh) preached monotheism, that was obviously not tolerable to them. The Romans allowed many gods, but persecuted Christians too.


Khadijah, a very successful business women in her own right, was a monotheist and most probably Christian Nestorian like her uncle - some Islamic scholars may disagree this shows the feminist view of those Kuffar and place any nonsense about how women were treated back then into the trash -like islamic claims of women being oppressed back then- .
- Despite her status, Khadija could not use her own money at her own discretion to participate in trade. She had to find a trustworthy *man* to do that on her behalf. Women were indeed treated very badly. Women were literally property, the wives of a man get inherited by his sons upon death, the wife never has the choice to marry herself or consent to marriage, women who are killed do not warrant blood revenge or blood money (unless the killer is another woman), little girls would be buried alive if born first (bad omen), a man can marry or divorce at whim as much as he wants without recourse, women could not participate in any commercial or political capacity at all, a man can share his own wife with others at his will, or give her away. One of the only ways a woman could find stature was poetry. Great poetry was cherished by the Arabs regardless of origin or gender.


When did the people of Mecca have issues with Muhammad? When Muhammad started to insult their gods, when they would wake up in the morning and find the statues of the gods dessicated and damaged, when Muhammad mock them that their gods are useless! Talk about tolerance??
- The Prophet (pbuh) did not desecrate their gods, what are you talking about! But you're right, they got really mad they were told the Truth, that rocks are just rocks. They reacted by persecuting, torturing, killing, blockading & dispossessing his followers. Sumaya was killed by a spear through her vagina, Talha was tortured hanged down with his head on fire, Bilal was tortured on sand dunes at noon with a bolder over his chest while his skin dries & falls exposing his flesh... with countless other Muslims. The Prophet (pbuh) himself was bludgeoned almost to death until he fainted with blood all over his body, he was chocked until he turned blue when one of the "nobles" of Quraysh put his foot on his neck, he often got a full belly of literal cow dung thrown at him when he prostrates in prayer... Yes, very liberal civilized people indeed...


But for me, this hadith throws the doors wide open on the story of Waraqah. The hadith suggest that shortly after Muhammad started getting the revelations "....But a short while later Waraqa died and the Divine Inspiration was paused (stopped) for a while so that Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) was very much grieved." Sahih al-Bukhari 4953
This proves Muhammad knew the man very well, and likely behind his inspiration!
- WT* are you even talking about?! You just disproved yourself. If Waraqa was the inspiration for Muhammed (pbuh) then he died, then we won't have a Quran now would we?!


islam plagiarized stories from Christianity and Judaism  
here is few that are mentioned in both the quran and the talmud/torah :
  • Gideon/Saul (Tālūt)
  • Saul, David and Goliath (Tālūt, Dāwūd and Jalut)
  • The Queen of Sheba
  • Jonah (Yūnus) and the big fish
  • Haman
- Similar names, different stories. Particularly, prophets in the Quran are portrayed as pious infallible & virtuous saints, unlike the Bible where they are portrayed as murderous villains capable of every evil known to Man, from massacre to idol worship to rape & incest & murder & infanticide & adultery & betrayal & intoxication....etc. Where is the "plagiarism"? The Quran literally states it is from the same tradition as the Torah & the Gospels... Plus, the Quranic version of the stories discard the inaccuracies & lies, while telling things the Prophet (pbuh) could not have possibly known, such as: the existence of Egyptian mummies (not in Bible), the deification of Egyptian rulers (not in Bible), the accurate description of the Egyptian ruler as "king" in the Joseph (pbuh) story & as "Pharaoh" in the Moses (pbuh) story after the title was adopted in the New Kingdom (no distinction in Bible), the eastward wind in Egypt, the accurate portrayal of Mesopotamian gods (Shamash, Sin & Ishtar) in the story of Abraham (pbuh) (Persian gods in Biblical tradition), the Ezra authorship of the Torah...etc.  


here is few stories that are mentioned in both the bible and the quran :
  • Zechariah (Zakariya) and John (Yahya)
  • Mary (Maryam)
  • Jesus (ʿIsa, Yeshuaʿ)
  • Moses (Mosa)
  • Abraham (ibraham)
  • Lot (Lut)
  • AntiChrist
  • Adam and Eve
  • Noah the ark and the flood
- Again, similar names. VERY different stories. You do not actually realize how little of the Bible is in the Quran. Quite! The Prophet (pbuh) needn't know the Bible to know these characters... You do realize he is a descendant of Abraham (pbuh) as well?! 

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Lunar108
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@Yassine
I'm going to say one thing
do you think that I an ex-muslim wouldn't know the stories about the religion I left  .

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@Lunar108
I'm going to say one thing
do you think that I an ex-muslim wouldn't know the stories about the religion I left  .
- If anything the article confirms what I said... Your point...? This does not address anything I said. 

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@Lunar108
There's no such thing as religious plagiarism, really. The contents of all our religions go into the cultural mixing pot and everyone dips into it.
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@Castin
There's no such thing as religious plagiarism, really. The contents of all our religions go into the cultural mixing pot and everyone dips into it.
- Maybe, but the objecting argument here is aimed at proving human provenance, thus undermining divine inspiration.
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Lunar108
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@Lunar108


- Use your words. Or have a formal debate with me, stop running! 
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@Yassine
I'm not running away an you've yet to provide any evidence that those stories didn't exist in islam because muhammad went with the caravan also
هو ورقة بن نوفل بن أسد بن عبد العزى بن قصي، وهو ابن عم خديجة بنت خويلد، زوجة النبي محمد حيث أن والده نوفل بن أسد هو أخ والدها خويلد بن أسد.
christianity was already established in mecca and even jews lived around there so it's no wonder that muhammad copied many stories from both the bible and tulmod 
I also forgot to mention the story of Cain and Abel
- About 6% of the stories do indeed have parallels in the Bible. Another half have parallels in Biblical Apocrypha, the Talmud, Zoroastrian traditions & Arab pagan traditions, few in the Vedas, plus some ancient Sumerian & Egyptian sources. The rest of the stories & the rest of the Quran has nothing to do with all of that.
I would love to see any evidence supporting the claim which you've made about the stories from the bible and tulmod being less than 6*%
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Yassine
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@Lunar108
I'm not running away
- Where the debate at then?


an you've yet to provide any evidence that those stories didn't exist in islam because muhammad went with the caravan
- Wut?


هو ورقة بن نوفل بن أسد بن عبد العزى بن قصي، وهو ابن عم خديجة بنت خويلد، زوجة النبي محمد حيث أن والده نوفل بن أسد هو أخ والدها خويلد بن أسد.
- What's up with the lineage? 


christianity was already established in mecca and even jews lived around there so it's no wonder that muhammad copied many stories from both the bible and tulmod 
- None of this is true. Not because it comes out of your mouth, somehow magically it becomes true! There were no Jews settlement in Mecca, or Christian. Jewish settlements in Arabia are known (Yathrib, Khaybar, Sanaa..), so were Christian settlements (Najran, Dawmat Jundal...).


I also forgot to mention the story of Cain and Abel
- The Bible itself has multiple versions of that story... LOL!


I would love to see any evidence supporting the claim which you've made about the stories from the bible and tulmod being less than 6*%
- This questions shows that you have no effing clue what you're talking about. If you even know a little about the Biblical stories & the Quranic stories you wouldn't have asked that. LOL! Regardless, this is not my claim, it's the estimate of those in the field. Why don't you do the exercise yourself. Find me the story in the Quran which looks like the story in the Bible, & see how much similarity they share. Have at it.
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Lunar108
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@Yassine
I would love to see any evidence supporting the claim which you've made about the stories from the bible and tulmod being less than 6*%
- This questions shows that you have no effing clue what you're talking about. If you even know a little about the Biblical stories & the Quranic stories you wouldn't have asked that. LOL! Regardless, this is not my claim, it's the estimate of those in the field. Why don't you do the exercise yourself. Find me the story in the Quran which looks like the story in the Bible, & see how much similarity they share. Have at it.
and I would love to see where did this estimation came from , the source , the book mentioning it, the study mentioning it ?
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@Lunar108
and I would love to see where did this estimation came from , the source , the book mentioning it, the study mentioning it ?
- I've read too many books to know where that's from. Maybe I'd be more eager to look if in w formal debate. You haven't done the exercise I asked.

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Lunar108
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@Yassine
and I would love to see where did this estimation came from , the source , the book mentioning it, the study mentioning it ?
- I've read too many books to know where that's from. Maybe I'd be more eager to look if in w formal debate. You haven't done the exercise I asked.

the very convenient claim of I forgot where I read it , just tell me you made that up no need to spin tall tales about it 
I also had evidence claiming that more than 50% of the stories quran stories were mentioned in the bible and tulmod too 
but as you know .
I've read too many books to know where that's from.
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@Lunar108
the very convenient claim of I forgot where I read it , just tell me you made that up no need to spin tall tales about it 
I also had evidence claiming that more than 50% of the stories quran stories were mentioned in the bible and tulmod too 
- Show me one.



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Lunar108
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@Yassine
and I would love to see where did this estimation came from , the source , the book mentioning it, the study mentioning it ?
- I've read too many books to know where that's from. Maybe I'd be more eager to look if in w formal debate. You haven't done the exercise I asked.



the very convenient claim of I forgot where I read it , just tell me you made that up no need to spin tall tales about it 
I also had evidence claiming that more than 50% of the stories quran stories were mentioned in the bible and tulmod too 
but as you know .
I've read too many books to know where that's from.
too 
- Show me one.

show me yours first 

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@Lunar108
- The BOP is on you, you claimed 50% similarity. Show me a single example of that.