Smollett: what now?

Author: Stephen

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#1
Stephen
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Will this man now be charged further?

Not being an American I obviously do not know US law. But I am reasonably sure that had this racist hoax happened here in the UK there maybe further charges, i.e. behaviour likely to cause a riot/public disturbance or  behaviour likely to incite an affray.

And lets not forget this was a racist hoax against white people, i.e. a hate crime .
#2
zedvictor4
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@Stephen
I'm not so sure Stephen.

How seriously hate crime against "White" people in the U.K would be regarded.....Would depend upon the  ethnic origin of the "White" person.

We're currently going through a sort of payback phase.

And of course, gender would also be an important factor.
#3
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@Stephen
He faces three years in prison, and his career is over. As far as I'm concerned he will pay what he owes. My problem is with all of the high level figures, including the now President and Vice President of the United States, who believed this transparently obvious hoax. Where is the accountability? I knew it was bullshit within fifteen seconds. It honestly makes me question these peoples ability to reckon with reality. This is beyond an ideological disagreement, if someone couldn't tell that this story had some serious issues from the get-go, I don't know what to say but I do know that I'm not trusting their judgement ever again

#4
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@thett3
He faces three years in prison, and his career is over. As far as I'm concerned he will pay what he owes
Completely agree with at least this part! :)
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@ludofl3x
What do you make of the second part of my post? 
#6
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  • A Trump biographer, Tim O'Brien, tweeted the quote from a 2002 profile of Epstein in New York magazine, in which Trump said: "I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy. He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side."

#7
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@thett3
I definitely want Mr. Smollett to pay back what he owes the police for wasting their valuable time. Like you, it also irks me that many are so eager to believe in hate crimes. Even when the hoax was largely exposed, many responded, “Yes, but hate crimes still happen with alarming frequency!” Ok, but staging a hate crime must fill a need— a need to be seen as a victim. This is where identity politics has taken us:  putting victimhood on a pedestal…
#8
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@thett3
I'm inferring from your posts you're a conservative type, and I have a real hard time with people asking for accountability from politicians over something that has no direct impact on anyone but this guy, when there appears to me no demand for the same accountability on their own team. Maybe you're different, maybe you think Gossar should be kicked out of COngress, for example, so if I'm assuming incorrectly I apologize, but conservatives haven't exactly been the party of accountability for a loooong time. Matt Gaetz for example is accused of some pretty gross stuff, people have resigned for less, and yes I know they're accusations, but politicians on both sides resigned for less because of accountability. 
#9
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@ludofl3x
Fair enough. I do consider myself right leaning, although these days it’s more out of fear of the left than out of policy, outside of a few things I’m pretty much in the center. I definitely do have a double standard where I judge the left more harshly, but that’s because I’m culturally (not economically through the grace of God) a working class white person. When I see false blood libel about how evil whites are, all these hate crime hoaxes, etc I see something that could foster resentment that has a direct impact on me and my family. When I see “whiteness” being used as a term of invective, I see it as an attack. 

When I see bad behavior from the right I dislike it and I do criticize it sometimes. But it doesn’t flash the “attack! Attack! Attack!” Alarm bells in my lizard brain that the left does. I’m trying to be less biased though, I was pretty much a Trump shill during his time in office but after the election I’ve soured on him a lot and want someone new and I try to push back on the anti vaccine stuff. I don’t actually know what Gosar did so can’t comment on it 
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@thett3
What a refreshingly honest and self aware reply, thanks! That's how dialogues are opened, understanding that you can disagree with someone without them being your mortal enemy worthy of revulsion. I'm not in any way far left, I'd be left leaning myself. I don't have the same reaction you do to whiteness stuff, and I'm a working class white guy myself. We all have different experiences. 
#11
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@thett3
He faces three years in prison, and his career is over. As far as I'm concerned he will pay what he owes.

I don't agree. As Dr. Sowell noted, race baiting is an extremely lucrative career in America and there is no logical reason to think that one jury verdict can change that.

As long as there exists die-hard followers of the religion of racism, there will always be race-baiters looking to make a buck or win public office.

There's no logical reason to expect the usual people won't erect a temple in his honor after his sentence is up.
#12
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@Greyparrot
-->@thett3
He faces three years in prison, and his career is over. As far as I'm concerned he will pay what he owes.

I don't agree.
You don't agree that this is an appropriate punishment? 

There's no logical reason to expect the usual people won't erect a temple in his honor after his sentence is up.
Who are these people?
#13
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@ludofl3x
You don't agree that this is an appropriate punishment? 

I don't agree that he is going to "pay" anything as Thett puts it. If anything, it's an investment on his way to race-bait stardom.

Who are these people?

The people who don't agree with the MLK dream.
#14
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@Stephen
I believe he faces upwards of 20 years in prison for all of the crimes he was convicted of. However, what happens now is most likely a slap on the wrist. I'd be shocked if he served even a quarter of that time.

What should happen is him being charged with a hate crime for blood libeling White people with his fake allegations. Unfortunately no such law is on the books.

So what happens now is that he won't be made an example of, and we will continue to see hate crime hoaxes in America, as we have perverse incentives to do so over here. Had he not been caught, this would have been a massive career boosting move. It is very lucrative to be a (non-White) high-profile victim of a hate crime.
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#15
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@thett3
He faces three years in prison, and his career is over.

From what I can gather the feeling is that Smollett won't even get to see a jailers keys. And it is more likely that he will become some kind of political civil rights figure in the line of Sharpton. Didn't Sharpton also make his name (not to mention a lucrative income) on the back of a race hate hoax?
BLM have already said they don't accept the verdict and "believe Jussie". 

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#16
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@zedvictor4
[people in the U.K ] We're currently going through a sort of payback phase.

Payback for what? 
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#17
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@bmdrocks21
What should happen is him being charged with a hate crime for blood libeling White people with his fake allegation.

I agree. I have yet to see any MSM pundit even mention the possible consequences of his hoax. Not to mention the set back to race relations in the US that he may have caused.


Unfortunately no such law is on the books.

So you have no laws against incitement in the US?


-----------------------------------------------------
As an aside, I came across a piece concerning BLM and the defacing of property at Elvis Presley's Graceland's in Memphis Tennessee.  I was disgusted not necessarily by the vandalism so much (as mindless as that was)  but by the pure fkn  ignorance  of a man that had broken many barriers  and the bridges he had built between black and white simply through music. I found that quite sad and upsetting.

 -----------------------------------------------------
#18
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@Stephen
Well the general focus used to be the Slave Trade.....But now it's roughly the period between 1950 and the present. 

Migration and social evolution has always been difficult.

And different sides of the equation had a tendency to only see their own side of the equation....Which was to be expected.

Intolerance is a two sided state of mind.....Though unfortunately were expected to accept that it has only ever been one sided.
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#19
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@zedvictor4
Well the general focus used to be the Slave Trade.....

Well  to me that would require a thread all of its own. With that said, I never owned a slave neither did any of my family  to my knowledge. The only time slavery   was ever mentioned in my family was when my old dad and uncles spoke about the slavery in the coal mines of Wales, where many of  my males relations worked in terrible conditions at 14 hours a day and this included males as young as five years old. Have you ever visited Big Pit  in Blaenavon, Torfaen, Wales, Vic. Its a museum now. I would recommend anyone of any age or colour visit it, then compare the  wide open cotton fields to the dangerous, dank and pitch black conditions of Big Pit.

Besides, how far should this shite go back. Swathes of England/Wales were overran by Vikings if I am to hold any faith in my history teachers. Do I  now demand reparations from all Scandinavian countries for their "crimes" of the 9th century committed  by king Uthred or Queen Olga against my ancestors? Its a nonsense and any level headed person on the planet knows this.


But now it's roughly the period between 1950 and the present. 

Well from what I recall from my own youth was that the "race riots" were mainly to do with unfair treatment by authorities (police) than it was black against white. Although I did witness some  running battles between black people and skinheads in my school days. 


Migration and social evolution has always been difficult.

I don't believe anyone could dispute that, Vic.



Intolerance is a two sided state of mind.....Though unfortunately were expected to accept that it has only ever been one sided.

I agree. And on a personal level I believe following the death of George Floyd Jr, a problem imported from the USA  to the UK by BLM/antifa, that race relations here at home have been set back decades. I can only hope that the majority of our youth, white and black can and will see through this BS.

And if this centuries old "one sided" argument of slavery is now  to be taught in our schools it should be taught with full honesty and from its roots that began in the Middle East where, to my own knowledge, Arab slave traders traded with blacks that rounded up other blacks from other black enemy tribes  to sell on to Arab slavers.
All my own opinion you understand, Vic lad.

Have a good day.
#20
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@Stephen
For sure Stephen.

And I'm pretty certain that Black Africans enslaved Black Africans.

And White Europeans enslaved White Europeans.

And move on.

As I'm sure the majority of our youth are doing.

And I'm proud of our diverse society here in the U.K. 

One World

One People.


Have a good day too Stephen.
#21
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@Stephen
So you have no laws against incitement in the US?
We do, but I don’t believe that most cases of fake police reports would generally be considered incitement. Generally incitement is when you actively call for violence via speech as far as I know.


I agree. I have yet to see any MSM pundit even mention the possible consequences of his hoax. Not to mention the set back to race relations in the US that he may have caused.
Which is why I think it should be a hate crime. He is artificially inflating the anger of Blacks towards Whites. The fact that in the report he consciously chose to say the perpetrators were White is at the very least an attempt to denigrate Whites, and at the worst incitement to commit reprisal attacks against them.

Just as a side thought, I wonder if freedom of speech plays into it not being incitement because there is no direct call to action for violence, and this is more of just a lie. And it would seem that that would fall right into the “hate speech” trap of creating anger towards others might lead to violence.

So I guess I’d say it should be a hate crime (essentially a mandatory felony sentence) to lie and say a specific other group committed a hate crime against you while also believing it shouldn’t be considered incitement
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#22
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@bmdrocks21
I agree. I have yet to see any MSM pundit even mention the possible consequences of his hoax. Not to mention the set back to race relations in the US that he may have caused.
Which is why I think it should be a hate crime. He is artificially inflating the anger of Blacks towards Whites. 

I suppose 'intent' would have to be proven which makes it all a bit tricky? 

#23
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@Stephen
I suppose 'intent' would have to be proven which makes it all a bit tricky? 

Yeah, in all reality, I doubt he wanted to incite attacks. I think that he recognized that would be a result, but he cared more about getting adoring attention than strangers being beaten.
#24
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@Stephen
In general, i just want this to hurt his life, and that precedent set. I just want it to set a precedent that it destroys "your" life to do this. But i don't think this should be a prison thing... it's a desperation thing, but whatever, i've been past it for awhile now. The law should be a little bit more proportional to income. Teach him a lesson by making his income the same as a new college students graduates income, and let him go from there. I think that is prison enough... if you get what i mean. From there, hopefully he can "work his way back up" to forgiveness, which i think should be on the table too. Humans are idiots, we can't bury a human for one mistake... but we should bury those that continue to hurt society as a whole. That's evolution and survival. We don't need poison. 
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@bmdrocks21
 but he cared more about getting adoring attention than strangers being beaten.

Can you really rule out that he hates white people?
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@Greyparrot
Can you really rule out that he hates white people?
Nope. He either does or is exceptionally self-absorbed. Perhaps both

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#27
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@Outplayz
In general, i just want this to hurt his life, and that precedent set. I just want it to set a precedent that it destroys "your" life to do this. But i don't think this should be a prison thing... it's a desperation thing, but whatever, i've been past it for awhile now. The law should be a little bit more proportional to income. Teach him a lesson by making his income the same as a new college students graduates income, and let him go from there. I think that is prison enough... if you get what i mean. From there, hopefully he can "work his way back up" to forgiveness, which i think should be on the table too. Humans are idiots, we can't bury a human for one mistake... but we should bury those that continue to hurt society as a whole. That's evolution and survival. We don't need poison. 
I understand what you are conveying here  and agree in part, but the repercussions of this could still be devastating coming on the back of  Floyd's death. I would like to believe it does end here for Smollett but I can't see the left; the Whoopi Goldbergs  &  and Joy Behars of the world  letting this go anytime soon. (There is an appeal I've heard).  And you won't see the likes them backpedalling anytime soon either. They will never admit how wrong they were and because the left never do. These two in particular will keep fanning the flames even if its only for their own benefit.

 Nice thoughtful post though, Outplayz. A+1
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I think Smollett wants to run for President as a Republican.  He showed them that he could tell a big lie to benefit himself.
He could be the new Trump.
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#30
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@Stephen
I agree with you, Stephen. Tho, still a little to my point, they won't backpedal bc it's not hurting their pockets.. if anything, it's making them money. I bet you they would be begging on their knees if stuff like this lost them money. And as crazy as this was, and as dangerous of a thing Smollett did... he still somehow has fans and is prob somehow still making money i bet... it's just arse backwards.