Schools should teach children that lbtq+ exists and its ok to be LGBTQ+

I know people will say that "its indoctrantation and will turn people gay" when there is 0 correlation. Its not teaching all of the biological factors of being transgender or gay its just explaining that they exist and are humans like anyone else.

Yes. Why are we even arguing this now? This is not 1960. Anyone who says no holds an outdated view.

Well, that depends on ones values.

Youd be suprised. Ben Shapiro (one of the biggest conservative talk show hosts in america) thinks its indoctrination.

I'm assuming your referring to christian values? the bible doesn't mention homosexuality a single time. https://www.hrc.org/resources/what-does-the-bible-say-about-homosexuality

though i have done little research and am an atheist

He'd better live in the 60's. I haven't watched him for a lot but I don't think this is indoctrination. It IS indoctrination however to teach the public that it is wrong to teach about existing and valid identities, so I don't see the point here.

Doesn't really matter if Atheist, Christian, Nihilist, Humanist, Russian.

None of those have a 'claim on one 'exact measure of values.

It's more. . 'Specific to whatever current population and time, you're referring to.

I think it's important to teach all forms of history, but from an objective lense and not a subjective one. That is my biggest problem with critical race theory.

Schools shouldn't take sides on the subject, it bypasses religious and political freedoms through state indoctrination. Instead, the subject should be taught in an objective manner.

It seems a bit difficult, to my thinking, to teach objective morals/behaviors/expected behavior in society?

Mmhm, exactly why they should teach that gay, bi, trans, asexual, etc, etc, and that's it fine for them to be like that (as in normatively fine within the social contract) - those are objective facts. 

Just like school ought to maintain that it's fine to be whatever ethnicity you are, or gender - because those are also facts - though I suspect one would still argue with the first line here. 

Schools should teach that people have the freedom to be gay, bi, trans, asexual, etc. and that it's fine that they have the freedom to do this. But our government institutions should NOT impose the belief that it is a moral good for people to do such. 

They have the right of self determination, to an extent, as American citizens, 'currently, I'll admit.

In other words, recreational sex education.

Which I'm pretty certain, most kids learn about from social media.

Why waste time with it in schools.

What you are wanting, is for schools to promote a biased opinion.

Is objective history even possible?

Objective history as the 'Left would have it, is the demonization of 'everything the white man ever did in America, even though it's clear enough admitted in the history books 'already, that mistakes, errors, flaws in character existed.

That 'school textbooks don't go into 'everything in detail, is just a limitation of palpability, and how much information can be crammed into students heads.

Though this is more my 'opinion and memory, than cited fact.

'My recollection of history, was 'not it being 'whitewashed as people claim, though that 'was a while ago, school.

To steal a Reddit user's post,

"Old-fashioned ideology: Columbus was a hero who discovered America.
Modern ideology: Columbus was a racist colonizer who oppressed the Native Americans.
Non-ideological: Columbus was an Italian explorer who sought passage to the East Indies. He was appointed as governor of the Indies, but was later removed from his position after accusations by his colonial subjects of brutality.

Another example:

Old-fashioned ideology: Martin Luther King was a civil rights hero who fought for equal rights for black people.
Modern ideology: Martin Luther King was a Black hero who stood up against white oppression and was murdered for it.
Non-ideological: Martin Luther King was a Christian minister and prominent figure in the civil rights movement of the 1960s. He was opposed to racial discrimination, poverty, capitalism, and the Vietnam war."

The problem is that homophobic parents will brutally brainwash their child and verbally abuse the child if he/she grows up to be LGBT+ regardless of this.

As a society, people only pretend they support forcefully separating abusive parents away from their children. Social Services in most countries that have it is a joke, the only step in when the abuse is blatant and irrefutable (sometimes the child is in a coma or already raped several times by this stage).

What do you do when a homophobic dad is mentally torturing the child and the mother agrees with what he's saying? That is literally bullying and abuse if the child is gay, trans etc. Nothing really we can do unless we support forcefully indoctrinating the children to accept LGBTQ+ and live happily as a brutal ethos.

Until we will stop abuse by being brutal to the abusers, we're just fucking posers really. Telling this in a class setting won't change a single homophobic household's life for the child.

I think you can teach the history of something by being objective about it. We were able to do as such for World History and many other subjects, I think it can be done with other curriculum as well.

The key in doing that is to not be subjective and to have an objective stance. An objective stance is, "gay marriage was illegal until 2015 in the United States of America." If that objective side of history is taught, I believe it should be taught. History and history and we learn and adapt through our history so we don't repeat the same mistakes. I think that is essential in our society

What class should this be taught in?

Um... wrong - the government does this all the time: with the military, with America as a nation, towards the police, towards fire fighters, towards people who do well on tests - the government enforces a lot of moral beliefs on others - also - unlike that stuff I'm saying Schools should say that it's OKAY to be these things - that it's "fine", is what I said - not that it's morally right - just neutral. 

As it is, empirically and ethically speaking. 

No, the schools job is to teach not say anti LGBTQ’s are bad people, miss me with that.

Notwithstanding that everything that is supposedly objective, is fundamentally subjective.

In this case what you are proposing is the teaching of a biased subjective opinion (State indoctrination)....Which is nothing new I suppose, as we've been promoting religion in schools for centuries.

It would be more objective to give kids both sides of the argument and allow them to make up their own minds about recreational sex.

Or as I stated previously....Leave it to social media.

Schools should teach people have rights and those rights are not to be violated. Schools should not attempt to pick and choose which groups are worthy of value and which are not in a free society. 

You're strawmanning me. I never once said the government should never take moral sides on anything ever in our schools. I said the government should not take moral sides on this particular issue other than to say it is "OKAY" to be LGBTQ+ under law.

@#23

Why is it wrong to tell people right from wrong, wrong from right?

Parents of course having the 'closest relationship with their children, then the state, then whatever job or community one 'has to live in (Mandatory training videos in workplace, so on)

But there's 'always going to be people indoctrinating, 'telling the kid what's what.

Better then, that it's their parents, and the state (With the parents permission) given that the state's instructing the kid on everything else.

Sure one might say church will teach the kid right and wrong, but unless it's a private school with a church, won't be happening 'that much I imagine.

As you say, other option is,

"Leave it to social media." - zedvictor4

Too Many Cooks vs. Don't Hug Me I'm Scared: Decoding the Disturbing – Wisecrack Edition - YouTube (7:26 in)

Though, what I disagree with drlebronski and Theweakeredge on, is teaching that "lbtq+ exists and its ok to be LGBTQ+" to people that disagree.

I think all I could say has already been said in this topic, but I think I can sum it up like this:

If you think it's a sin or bad or wrong to be gay or trans, don't be gay or trans. It's not a choice, but we'll pretend that it is. Why is it necessary to push your values onto others?

It's objective that 2SLGBTQQIAAPN+ identities exist and are normal. That's all children need to be taught. If you're worried that your kid will become LGBTQ+ because they're taught that LGBTQ+ people exist, the education system is not 'pushing their own values/infringing on religious freedom', you're just manipulating your child to conform to your worldview/religion by limiting their access to information.

Also, if anyone wants someone to break down the passages in the bible quoted by homophobes, hit me up.

based

Well. 

Right and wrong in this context is a construct relative to a biased point of view.

And therefore a biased viewpoint promoted in schools  by a biased  social sub-group, should itself be subject to similar moral scrutiny.

Or preferably, best not promoted in schools at all.

Sperm, egg reproduction fine.

Recreational sex.....Will they be introducing practical hands on demonstrations of all the available options?

No...Just some mildly embarrassed teacher waffling on about how it's ok to have your dick cut off.....Sound advice.

Though as I keep saying....Most kids will already know this stuff, and will  already have seen the video's.

I don't remember learning much morality or ethics in school, myself.

Though I suppose in Language Arts, there were fiction and autobiographies.

That one received moral lessons of a 'sort from, but I don't 'remember in depth discussions on ethics or morality.

'Might have been though.

History class, one year, had a thing each week where each student researched some foreign affairs event.

That 'might have been discussed a bit, I don't recall.

Pretty sure sex education was had at 'some point, but it didn't stick in my mind really.

Personally, for some subjects, I think I'd rather schools just sent parents a pamphlet in the mail, detailing how to explain the birds and the bees, or recommending that the parents tell their kids about birth control, if they 'can't wait, but still encouraging the kid to wait.

Though I imagine 'most parents already do the talk.

Though straight sex education, is off the topic of explaining the existence of lbtq+ or schools going out of their way to 'endorse saying its 'ok to be LGBTQ+. . .