The Case of Daunte Wright

Author: Vader

Posts

Total: 22
Topic's author
#1
Vader
Vader's avatar
Debates: 30
Posts: 14,984
5
8
11
Vader's avatar
Vader
5
8
11
The Facts of the Case
  • Daunte Wright had a warrant for his arrest
  • The dashcam video clearly shows that Wright ran away and attempted to resist arrest
  • The dashcam video shows the officer indicated to grab "a taser." Instead the gun was pointed and shot the man
  • The cop realized that she accidentally used the gun instead of the gun
  • Officer resigned after knowing of her mistake. The officer didn't have a track record and this was her first mistake
The Opinion
  • First things first, the women did the right thing by resigning herself. To make mistakes in such a field despite years of experience can not be tolerated. If a pharmacist were to give the wrong drugs to a patient, they would be fired and likely sued for negligence. I don't think that she meant to kill him, but can she use her brain? She had 5 seconds to distinguish between a gun and a taser and she couldn't do that? Pathetic
  • No I do not think this was an intentional act. He was pulled over for having an expired registry. If you have a warrant for an arrest, if you are caught, the cop can pull you over. The guy ran and fled, and a taser can be used at the time
  • So while I do think the officer should resign, I do not think it was race motivated. People make mistakes and to think that a mistake can't be made is foolish. Sadly it was a fatal mistake. I do think she should be charged with negligent homicide. First or second degree is not right for the case

#2
zedvictor4
zedvictor4's avatar
Debates: 22
Posts: 12,071
3
3
6
zedvictor4's avatar
zedvictor4
3
3
6
@SupaDupa

How can one accidentally use a gun instead of a gun?
#3
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 574
Posts: 19,931
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
The problem with guns being so legal in the US and so prevalent illegally too, is that cops are trained to be ready to be vs an active shooter, as a baseline reflex. 

This is why these things just do not happen much in any other country on the planet. The reason is that in all other countries, the baseline reflex is that they predict the criminal is either not possessing a firearm or that they know you don't ever shoot a cop.

Instead, US has not just got a pro-gun culture to deal with, they seem to genuinely have (or at least had) criminals that are far more willing to shoot cops in broad daylight. This has then resulted in a vicious cycle.

I have absolutely no idea why the US doesn't do what every single other highly developed nation has done and remove its guns via several sting operations. Undercover work and sting operations can and will annihilate illegal gun trade. It always works, in all nations that have done it. Not saying 100% but to 98% efficacy at least.

You simply do not get people with guns as a baseline worry in other highly developed nations (actually you so get it in most underdeveloped nations too). There is no country other than the US where this particular issue if cops gunning down or brutally handling criminals in fear of the criminals being able and willing to murder them is so widespread, racism is a whole other layer of issue there but the actual cop preparedness to be vs an armed and willing assailant is so unlike any other nation's police force. 
#4
bmdrocks21
bmdrocks21's avatar
Debates: 6
Posts: 2,798
4
6
11
bmdrocks21's avatar
bmdrocks21
4
6
11
-->
@Vader
Some may call me sexist, but I see this as an inherent issue when you have 120lb women who are put in dangerous situations with large men.
#5
AddledBrain
AddledBrain's avatar
Debates: 0
Posts: 65
0
1
4
AddledBrain's avatar
AddledBrain
0
1
4
Admittedly, I don't know how a taser is activated but, it seems to me, if pistols are designed to be fired using the index finger, tasers should be designed to use a thumb trigger.  This should go a long way to preventing the mix-up.
#6
Double_R
Double_R's avatar
Debates: 3
Posts: 5,260
3
2
5
Double_R's avatar
Double_R
3
2
5
Tragedy aside, I think this case in interesting in one particular respect, that it highlights the complete divide and alternate realities by which we take in the news, even when the event in question is on video.

Most on the right look at this video and their immediate inclination is to point to yet another example of a black man resisting arrest. I understand this sentiment and for what it’s worth I think the left has shut themselves down to this, even though it is one of the biggest reasons why we keep seeing this happen. If Dante Wright had cooperated he would more than likely be alive today, that’s really not debatable. In fact this is the story of the vast majority of police shootings.

But then the question is, why are so many black people not cooperating? If that is the point you tend to focus on, this video is the perfect example. Here we have a 26 year officer who was in charge of training other officers, killing Dante because she couldn’t tell the difference between a glock and a taser. To make things worse, she was actually training the other two officers at the time and shot her “taser” into a car and at Dante’s chest, two things that the training manuals specifically tell you not to do. So if you see this and you are black or a sympathizer, this video is exactly the point you’re making.

So here we have two completely opposing viewpoints, both watching this video and both getting confirmation of their viewpoints from it. I’m not sure what the solution here is, but we can start by collectively acknowledging the obvious truths both sides are pointing to.
#7
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 25,978
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
-->
@bmdrocks21
120lb armed women. There's no option for those women to "de-escalate" and use physical force to restrain criminal behavior.
#8
bmdrocks21
bmdrocks21's avatar
Debates: 6
Posts: 2,798
4
6
11
bmdrocks21's avatar
bmdrocks21
4
6
11
-->
@Greyparrot
Yeah, considering tasers and pepper spray are often ineffective (especially when they aren’t mistaken for guns lol). 

It is very hard to detain people who are smaller than you, so her options are cap that boy or get knocked out 🤷🏼‍♂️
#9
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 574
Posts: 19,931
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@bmdrocks21
Ever heard of martial arts?
#10
Greyparrot
Greyparrot's avatar
Debates: 4
Posts: 25,978
3
4
10
Greyparrot's avatar
Greyparrot
3
4
10
Ever heard of martial arts?
Ever heard of Fallon Fox...oh yeah, lol!
#11
bmdrocks21
bmdrocks21's avatar
Debates: 6
Posts: 2,798
4
6
11
bmdrocks21's avatar
bmdrocks21
4
6
11
@RM

Despite what superhero movies show you, a tiny woman can't just take down a 200lb man because she knows karate
#12
thett3
thett3's avatar
Debates: 2
Posts: 2,064
3
2
7
thett3's avatar
thett3
3
2
7
-->
@bmdrocks21
Despite what superhero movies show you, a tiny woman can't just take down a 200lb man because she knows karate
Yeah, this death lies squarely at the feet of those that won't allow society to discuss things that might hurt some feelings. Although this victim did not appear to be a particularly large man from what I saw, no doubt he would've been able to kill the female officer with relative ease hand to hand if she was alone and he wanted to. From a purely animalistic, fight or flight reaction perspective, reaching for the gun instead of the tazer WAS the rational choice. A violent man, and certainly a LARGE violent man is a lethal threat to a woman, even if unarmed. It's why the idea of a female beat cop is so ridiculous. The physical disparity between them and any criminals they are likely to encounter is too great. 

It's the same for people who want women to go into combat roles in the military--they simply aren't thinking. Even if we disregard the military studies that have demonstrated conclusively that units with women are less effective, nobody takes a serious look at what would actually happen to women in warfare. Female POWs would be raped continuously until they died. I'm not willing to condemn some girl in over her head and raised on a diet cheesy movies that obscure the true nature of violence to that for the sake of avoiding hurt feelings. 
#13
bmdrocks21
bmdrocks21's avatar
Debates: 6
Posts: 2,798
4
6
11
bmdrocks21's avatar
bmdrocks21
4
6
11
-->
@thett3
I couldn't agree more. There are just some things that men and women respectively should not do. I remember that (mainly Democrats) in Congress opposed new fitness requirements because not enough women were in the trials.

They don't care if the new fitness requirement is a good idea. They see that less women are going to get in the military and think that is some great evil. If the primary objective of the military is not to keep us safe and is instead to meet some bureaucrat or congressperson's diversity quota that makes them feel better, guess what: we aren't going to be as safe.

Have we even won a war since the military became obsessed with diversity?
#14
Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
Accidental or not she shot a man and killed him. It's manslaughter. A civilian would get the same. And she was assisting two male officers. 
#15
Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
-->
@bmdrocks21
Have we even won a war since the military became obsessed with diversity?
You blaming Vietnam on women? Sorry but flying a plane, driving a tank and shooting a gun are not just male activities. We don't fight with swords anymore. 
#16
Theweakeredge
Theweakeredge's avatar
Debates: 33
Posts: 3,457
4
7
10
Theweakeredge's avatar
Theweakeredge
4
7
10
-->
@Vader
"First things first, the women did the right thing by resigning herself. To make mistakes in such a field despite years of experience can not be tolerated. If a pharmacist were to give the wrong drugs to a patient, they would be fired and likely sued for negligence. I don't think that she meant to kill him, but can she use her brain? She had 5 seconds to distinguish between a gun and a taser and she couldn't do that? Pathetic"
Um... so that "mistake" - which we can totally prove is a only a mistake - can be rectified by simply resigning? Can we not see how this is a problem, she should be charged, at the least, for manslaughter. I mean, why wouldn't she, she accidentally killed a guy right? 


"No I do not think this was an intentional act. He was pulled over for having an expired registry. If you have a warrant for an arrest, if you are caught, the cop can pull you over. The guy ran and fled, and a taser can be used at the time"
Riight - you see - the problem here is that black people tend to be shot more than white people, and also tend to be unarmed more often than white people, so.... the general trend would suggest that this person did it intentionally, right? That's what the general trends say, now, we can't automatically assume that's the case - but we can say its at least likely to be the case? Right? Now, what evidence do we have that this person did this accidentally? That a taser and a gun are the similar enough in size, shape, and weight that one could mistake one for the other.... a problem - guns are on average twice the weight of a taser, they are longer, and are shaped radically different.... and cops are trained for fast response - so... the evidence seems to point away from the assertion that she made a mistake.

So, in conclusion, the evidence -in general- seems to point that she didn't make a mistake, and the evidence in general points away from the assertion that she made a mistkae. So.... most likely they purposely killed the guy? That's what the evidence most likely suggests, no?

 "while I do think the officer should resign, I do not think it was race motivated. People make mistakes and to think that a mistake can't be made is foolish. Sadly it was a fatal mistake. I do think she should be charged with negligent homicide. First or second degree is not right for the case"
Negligent homicide? Its interesting that you point this out now, you see, it assumes that they made a mistake, but furthermore, it goes against what you said before: "First things first, the women did the right thing by resigning herself", No, the right thing would be turning herself in for homicide? Right? Why is resigning herself seen as a good thing whenever its about as good as slapping a bandaid on a 3rd degree burn? It seems that you don't believe she should be charged that strongly? 
Topic's author
#17
Vader
Vader's avatar
Debates: 30
Posts: 14,984
5
8
11
Vader's avatar
Vader
5
8
11
-->
@Theweakeredge
"First things first, the women did the right thing by resigning herself. To make mistakes in such a field despite years of experience can not be tolerated. If a pharmacist were to give the wrong drugs to a patient, they would be fired and likely sued for negligence. I don't think that she meant to kill him, but can she use her brain? She had 5 seconds to distinguish between a gun and a taser and she couldn't do that? Pathetic"
Um... so that "mistake" - which we can totally prove is a only a mistake - can be rectified by simply resigning? Can we not see how this is a problem, she should be charged, at the least, for manslaughter. I mean, why wouldn't she, she accidentally killed a guy right? 
I suggested she be charge for negligent homicide


"No I do not think this was an intentional act. He was pulled over for having an expired registry. If you have a warrant for an arrest, if you are caught, the cop can pull you over. The guy ran and fled, and a taser can be used at the time"
Riight - you see - the problem here is that black people tend to be shot more than white people, and also tend to be unarmed more often than white people, so.... the general trend would suggest that this person did it intentionally, right?
The general trend also suggests that black people commit more crimes than white people and black on black crime is higher than black on white crime. 
That's what the general trends say, now, we can't automatically assume that's the case - but we can say its at least likely to be the case? Right? Now, what evidence do we have that this person did this accidentally?
If she intentionally meant to kill someone, she wouldn't have said, oh shit I shot him and scream "Taser taser taser"
That a taser and a gun are the similar enough in size, shape, and weight that one could mistake one for the other.... a problem - guns are on average twice the weight of a taser, they are longer, and are shaped radically different.... and cops are trained for fast response - so... the evidence seems to point away from the assertion that she made a mistake.
Again, you haven't been in that situation, neither have I. Yes there is a difference and it was HER fault for not correctly drawing a taser. A lot of adrenaline and stuff goes through your mind, especially if your suspect resists arrests and goes into their car. She fucked up, no one is denying that, but do you really think this is race charged.

So, in conclusion, the evidence -in general- seems to point that she didn't make a mistake, and the evidence in general points away from the assertion that she made a mistkae. So.... most likely they purposely killed the guy? That's what the evidence most likely suggests, no?
I think her screaming "Taser taser taser" is enough to suggest she made a mistake. 

 "while I do think the officer should resign, I do not think it was race motivated. People make mistakes and to think that a mistake can't be made is foolish. Sadly it was a fatal mistake. I do think she should be charged with negligent homicide. First or second degree is not right for the case"
Negligent homicide? Its interesting that you point this out now, you see, it assumes that they made a mistake, but furthermore, it goes against what you said before: "First things first, the women did the right thing by resigning herself", No, the right thing would be turning herself in for homicide? Right? Why is resigning herself seen as a good thing whenever its about as good as slapping a bandaid on a 3rd degree burn? It seems that you don't believe she should be charged that strongly? 

No she shouldn't. People make mistakes and should suffer consequences. She has a family and 3 kids at home. To lock her away for life in prison when it was clearly negligent training seems like overpunishment 
#18
Theweakeredge
Theweakeredge's avatar
Debates: 33
Posts: 3,457
4
7
10
Theweakeredge's avatar
Theweakeredge
4
7
10
-->
@Vader
Aside from the rhetoric, the only real rebuttal is that black people commit more crime.... and that's - just false - proportionally white people commit more general violent crime. There is an argument that there is a period of time that black people committed more robbery proportionately - if you accepted most likely biased sources sure, but generally, the race that most populates a country commits the most crimes proportionally. 

Also.... did you know this little statistical thing that happens whenever you focus on a specific demographic? That demographic begins to be overrepresented in your stats - that is a general fact that happens whenever you hyperfocus on a demographic, such as what happened to black people.
#19
bmdrocks21
bmdrocks21's avatar
Debates: 6
Posts: 2,798
4
6
11
bmdrocks21's avatar
bmdrocks21
4
6
11
-->
@Polytheist-Witch
You blaming Vietnam on women?
We didn't lose the war. We demolished them, had a ceasefire, and never reengaged after North Vietnam attack the South again because we stopped caring. 

Sorry but flying a plane, driving a tank and shooting a gun are not just male activities.
They clearly should be.

We don't fight with swords anymore. 
On this, we agree.
#20
Lemming
Lemming's avatar
Debates: 7
Posts: 3,350
4
4
10
Lemming's avatar
Lemming
4
4
10
-->
@Polytheist-Witch
@Polytheist-Witch
Accidental or not she shot a man and killed him. It's manslaughter. A civilian would get the same.
If she showed up to duty drunk, the charges would stick, I'd think.
Problem I 'think is that some jobs deal with situations in which a mistake can lead to death, thus we give the individuals involved more leeway.
A police officer 'must seek out these confrontations, a civilian need not.

@NoOneInParticular
#21
Polytheist-Witch
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Debates: 1
Posts: 4,188
3
3
6
Polytheist-Witch's avatar
Polytheist-Witch
3
3
6
-->
@bmdrocks21
They clearly should be.
No they shouldn't. There is not physical strength qualifications for those. They are skill based.
#22
RationalMadman
RationalMadman's avatar
Debates: 574
Posts: 19,931
10
11
11
RationalMadman's avatar
RationalMadman
10
11
11
-->
@bmdrocks21
We didn't lose the war. 
You lost the war despite demolishing them because they turned the US people against their corrupt and merciless government. The military you pride yourself on were slaughtering families, entire villages in the jungle if they so pleased. The Vietnamese were much smarter than the US predicted, they exposed the US for what it was doing and held important hostages such as John McCain until US begged them to make peace.