Would a Human Clone Have a Soul?

Author: Reece101

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#1
Reece101
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I’m curious what my abrahamic friends think.

As an atheist I come from the standpoint that God is omniscient (all-knowing), omnipotent (all-powerful), and omnipresent (all-present). 
All Christians I’ve talked to affirm this, until I start pushing them on it. They then say he limits himself from foresight of freewill. Which is kinda weird if he’s eternal. 

But anyway, would a human clone created by freewill have a soul?



#2
Intelligence_06
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Define soul.

Define clone.

If a clone is built exactly the same as a human and can operate normally, then if humans have souls, this clone has a soul.

#3
Stephen
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@Intelligence_06
If a clone is built exactly the same as a human and can operate normally, then if humans have souls, this clone has a soul.


It should be that obvious., shouldn't it?
#4
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@Reece101
Please define soul as used in this context. 
#5
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The problem is if soul exists. We know that clones can be passed as humans, but if humans are not of a soul, neither can clones.
#6
oromagi
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Since there is no evidence that non-cloned humans have souls, we should proceed assuming that no humans have souls until evidence to the contrary is established.
#7
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@Reece101
Clone created by freewill.

Who's freewill?
#8
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@Reece101
They then say he limits himself from foresight of freewill. Which is kinda weird if he’s eternal.

It's not that God "limits" himself, it's that there can be no foresight of freewill, that is a contradiction of terms. It is nonsensical to claim that there can be foresight of free will.....Free will can't be known because of the endless dynamics of an endless amount of ways that can determine a choice. Omniscience (the capacity to know everything) only applies to things that qualify as knowable, in other words God knows everything that can be known. Individual choice does not qualify as something knowable because it is a spontaneous event, meaning that it can happen in a variety of ways rendering free will impossible to predetermine.

I'm also not one of these guys that push that God HAS to be omniscient...God knows what is knowable, all things that can be known. If you were to say "God's not omniscient then if God doesn't have foresight of freewill", my response would be I don't give a shyt, it's just a made up term anyways. God is a maximal Being, can know all things knowable, can do all things doable and be in all places at all times that have existence.

Would a Human Clone Have a Soul?

A soul is not a development of the processes of physics and chemistry, it exists independent of that. As far as I know, there are no known "human" clones, embryonic clones would only be associated with the developmental processes of the physical body, but a soul actually enters the womb after stages of early development. So, obviously a clone being without a soul is going to be a totally different product, one I'm not sure I want to witness.
It could be that a human clone could be a stillborn if allowed to fully develop, or possibly appear as something very bizarre. Because again, we're talking about a manufactured freak of nature. A soul cannot ever be duplicated through the hands of any science project. 

So, what we have are two things that take place when a human conception happens, you have the development of a physical body and the marriage of that form with a soul at some stage during (or after) embryonic development....which most likely occurs during the process of brain and neural development.
A soul is what makes a human being unique, animated and fully functioning as a highly conscious person. A physical body is nothing more than a machine meant to process chemistry, a clone is nothing close to a real conscious soul. What the question becomes for me, is can a soul be imparted into a clone job? that I don't know yet. But a soul exists with God before any physical body appears, it is created as a direct expression of God and has no association with an embodiment until it is sent to experience that world.


#9
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Not a Abrahamic monotheist but I would imagine if your born in a traditional way you have a soul and spirit.  We once had a discussion on test tube babies being off. Someone mentioned it in meditation group and someone else agreed. Both work in the medical field.  Energetically they come across as weird.  The people said they were nice kids but off somehow. Perhaps cloned people would be the same since they would have to be conceived outside the womb. I remember we thought it might have to do with the lack of mother sounds. Heart beat, darkness, body fluids, etc. Too sterile cause almost a detachment that wasn't as severe as once born and there is not input sensory wise for a child. 
#10
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@EtrnlVw
Can you actually prove any of the above?

As ever, I think not...And I suppose that you still think that you don't need to.


55 days later

#11
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@Reece101
I don't reckon you have ever talked to a christian about God.  (Respectfully, not in a deep manner anyway) If they agreed with that definition - then they really have little understanding of their god.   Most Christians would not see god in such a shallow dimensional manner. His overarching character trait which you omit is holiness.  

Still, I am not a theist, so it's no skin of my nose save and except that it would be nice to see some intellectual honesty. 

The question of a clone having a soul is an interesting one.  You would need to believe that people have souls in the first place. I don't so a clone is not going to have one.  On the other hand, if you believe in a soul, then it would be interesting to consider the idea of a clone. 

Is it the theist's view that a soul is separate from the body and the mind.  Or is it a combination of both.  I think the bible indicates that god made adam from the dust and then breathed into him - adam becoming a living soul.  Was he a dead soul prior to the breath or did he become a soul as a result of the breathe? I don't know.  It all sounds a bit far fetched to me.  

Is a soul part of our DNA or is it separate - like the consciousness? Is our consciousness part of our DNA? I'm no scientist. 

In my view - it would be no. humans don't have souls. And a clone is the photocopy of DNA.