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3RU7AL
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Admitting that racism is a thing, and calling it racism is an everybody who's actually rational thing
I disagree.

Discrimination is real.

The concept of "race" is fabricated.

Between 1660 and 1690 the RULING CLASS invented the term "WHITE RACE" very specifically as a tool to FRACTIONALIZE poor workers.

The English had a long history of separating themselves from others and treating foreigners, such as the Irish, as alien “others.” By the 17th century their policies and practices in Ireland had led to an image of the Irish as “savages” who were incapable of being civilized.

The social position of Africans in the early colonies has been a source of considerable debate. Some scholars have argued that they were separated from European servants and treated differently from the beginning. Later historians, however, have shown that there was no such uniformity in the treatment of Africans. Records indicate that many Africans and their descendants were set free after their periods of servitude. They were able to purchase land and even bought servants and slaves of their own.

Some African men became wealthy tradesmen, craftsmen, or farmers, and their skills were widely recognized. They voted, appeared in courts, engaged in business and commercial dealings, and exercised all the civil rights of other free men. Some free Africans intermarried, and their children suffered little or no special discrimination. Other Africans were poor and lived with other poor men and women; Blacks and whites worked together, drank together, ate together, played together, and frequently ran away together.

Moreover, the poor of all colours protested together against the policies of the government (at least 25 percent of the rebels in Bacon’s Rebellion [1676] were Blacks, both servants and freedmen). The social position of Africans and their descendants for the first six or seven decades of colonial history seems to have been open and fluid and not initially overcast with an ideology of inequality or inferiority.  

The colonial leaders found a solution to both problems: by the 1690s they had divided the restless poor into categories reflecting their origins, homogenizing all Europeans into a “white” category and instituting a system of permanent slavery for Africans, the most vulnerable members of the population.

Between 1660 and 1690, leaders of the Virginia colony began to pass laws and establish practices that provided or sanctioned differential treatment for freed servants whose origins were in Europe. They conscripted poor whites, with whom they had never had interests in common, into the category of free men and made land, tools, animals, and other resources available to them.  [LINK]

+proHUMAN +proFAMILY

Your scathing critique is requested.
Death23
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Racism is real and causes a substantial adverse impact on a significant fraction of American citizens. It is therefore a significant public policy concern. Data on pull-over rates suggests that race is a significant factor in causing a driver to be pulled over. ( https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/05/200507094621.htm ) Data on resume response rates suggest that having a black sounding name significantly decreases one's odds of landing a job. ( http://www-2.rotman.utoronto.ca/facbios/file/Whitening%20MS%20R2%20Accepted.pdf ) Data from hospitals suggests than black babies die significantly more often when they're under the care of white doctors ( https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3315 )

It also true that there are problems within the black community that are contributing to adverse outcomes. Issues like births out of wedlock and cultural problems discouraging educational achievement (i.e. "acting white") should also be of public interest. It's a shame that the debate ends up boiling down to finger pointing between the factions at the expense of real progress.
Theweakeredge
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@3RU7AL
Thanks for the ping.....
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@Death23
Also yeessss, that was exactly my point, thank you
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@3RU7AL
Just for some basic critiques:

The first use of a word does not mean that is forever the meaning of it: Take for example, God, else we would presume them simply powerful immortal individuals. What people think of as the current god would probably fit better under the term "primordial". So even if racism use to mean that, it no longer does. 

Second: Being against racism, even if you were correct in it's term-age, still wouldn't be true. Especially if people are against the term "racism" then there beliefs would actually line up with yours. But being against discrimination based on skin color, how is that wrong? Explain. Factually speaking, people have been separated into "white" and "black" categories. And yes, a lot of that is disingenuous, but it still happened, and people are still being discriminated against because of it.

There is more to life than hypotheticals and the values of it, there is also what is actually happening, and I think you fail to take that into consideration.
TXHG
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In terms of actually biology etc, race is not real. You are correct. However in terms of human interaction, race is very real and people are massively discriminated against because of it.

Anti-racism is about recognising the damage that racism does - which extends down to the existence of the very concept of race as a whole - and fighting against it.

If you'd like to learn more I'd suggest reading How To Be An Antiracist by Ibram X Kendi.
3RU7AL
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@TXHG
In terms of actually biology etc, race is not real.
People are discriminated against based on their skin-tone (and other empirically discernable characteristics).

The entire discussion of "race" is simply a mind-game devised to FRACTIONALIZE the working-class.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
So even if racism use to mean that, it no longer does. 
It started out as an arbitrary category and it is still used to describe an arbitrary category.

The main PROBLEM is that this category has been part of the language so long that people now think it's "SCIENTIFIC".
TXHG
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@3RU7AL
Yes, agreed. That doesn't equate to anti-raciam being racist.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
But being against discrimination based on skin color, how is that wrong? Explain.
I'm 100% against (public) discrimination based on skin-tone.

I'm 100% against (public) discrimination based on skin-tone.

I'm 100% against (public) discrimination based on skin-tone.

I'm also 100% against (public) discrimination based on any physical (or mental) characteristics.
Theweakeredge
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@3RU7AL
Again, you literally took my words out of context. Please actually employ reason next time.
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@TXHG
Yes, agreed. That doesn't equate to anti-raciam being racist.
Anyone who uses the word "race" or "racism" is reinforcing the FALSE idea that there is such a thing as "race".
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@3RU7AL
Also, only public? So you agree with racism as long as no one hears it? What the hell does that mean? 
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
Again, you literally took my words out of context. Please actually employ reason next time.
I'm not a mind-reader.
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@3RU7AL
THERE IS SUCH A THING AS RACE

Race is the same as currency. While yes. They are not literally things, culture and society have made them different. I implore you to look through all of my objections and actually engage with my argumentation, instead of taking single lines out of context and ignoring my points, because that is a pretty big pattern of things you do whenever you are disagreed with.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
Also, only public? So you agree with racism as long as no one hears it? What the hell does that mean? 
Does your inner circle of IRL friends contain at least one person of every possible skin-tone and or age and or level of physical and or mental "abledness"?
Theweakeredge
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@3RU7AL
But being against discrimination based on skin color, how is that wrong? 
The paragraph very clearly takes the context for you,

 Second: Being against racism, even if you were correct in it's term-age, still wouldn't be true. Especially if people are against the term "racism" then there beliefs would actually line up with yours. But being against discrimination based on skin color, how is that wrong? Explain. Factually speaking, people have been separated into "white" and "black" categories. And yes, a lot of that is disingenuous, but it still happened, and people are still being discriminated against because of it.

Its clearly setting up, that you said being anti-racist is racist, and I asked how so, after delivering context to what you were trying to claim. You are wrong for the same reason people saying all lives matter isn't racist are wrong.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
THERE IS SUCH A THING AS RACE
Please present your evidence for the validity of common "racial" categories.
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@3RU7AL
Does your inner circle of IRL friends contain at least one person of every possible skin-tone and or age and or level of physical and or mental "abledness"?
How is that relevant in racism? I don't choose friends (at all most times) based on those qualities. This isn't applicable, if I answered, "yes" obviously I would be lying, if I said, "no," then you would somehow try to twist it. I don't see the connection in this question whatsoever, I also don't see how this answers my question. Are you or are you not against private racism?
TXHG
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@3RU7AL
Obviously logically incorrect. If someone says "there is no such thing as race" they are using the word "race" but are not supporting the concept of races. Similarly if someone defines their anti-raciam as an opposition to the idea of race at all. Are you racist because you have used the word race and therefore reinforced the false idea that race exists? According to your own argument, yes!
Theweakeredge
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@3RU7AL
Did you ignore, literally everything else? No. Either full response to my post or you will get nothing. I am very tired of your cherry-picking statements to respond to. I will present the dichotomy again, either respond to the entire post or not at all. Or put some kind of indication that you actually read it all and aren't just skimming for statements you disagree with.

I explained myself in the rest of the post. Get off of your high horse.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
How is that relevant in racism? I don't choose friends (at all most times) based on those qualities. This isn't applicable, if I answered, "yes" obviously I would be lying, if I said, "no," then you would somehow try to twist it. I don't see the connection in this question whatsoever, I also don't see how this answers my question. Are you or are you not against private racism?
Your personal preference in who you associate does NOT constitute (public) discrimination.

It does however constitute (private) discrimination.

Public companies (companies open to the public) and public services (government) should not be allowed to discriminate on anything other than perhaps the actual ability to complete a specific task (no wheelchair-bound roofers for example).
3RU7AL
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@TXHG
Obviously logically incorrect. If someone says "there is no such thing as race" they are using the word "race" but are not supporting the concept of races. Similarly if someone defines their anti-raciam as an opposition to the idea of race at all. Are you racist because you have used the word race and therefore reinforced the false idea that race exists? According to your own argument, yes!
You win $100.00!!!!!!
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
Either full response to my post or you will get nothing.
If you feel like I've overlooked some "key element" of your position, please let me know, specifically what that "key element" entails.
3RU7AL
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@Theweakeredge
Thanks for the ping.....
3RU7AL
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@Death23
Data on pull-over rates suggests that race is a significant factor in causing a driver to be pulled over.
Isn't that simply discrimination based on skin-tone (not specifically "genetics")?
3RU7AL
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@Death23
Data on resume response rates suggest that having a black sounding name significantly decreases one's odds of landing a job.
Someone's name is an even less reliable indicator of someone's "genetic heritage" (race) than skin-tone.
3RU7AL
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@Death23
Data from hospitals suggests than black babies die significantly more often when they're under the care of white doctors
Yep.  Studies show a strong correlation between skin-tone (differences) and a wide range of medical outcomes.

Studies also show a strong correlation between skin-tone (differences) and general human empathetic responses.
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@Death23
It also true that there are problems within the POOR community that are contributing to adverse outcomes. Issues like births out of wedlock and cultural problems discouraging educational achievement (i.e. "acting smart") should also be of "public interest".
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@3RU7AL
Isn't that simply discrimination based on skin-tone (not specifically "genetics")?
That would be the direct factor in the study because that's what is being observed by the police officers who are making the decisions to pull people over. I would imagine that the underlying factor would be some in-group out-group thing going on. Though, I'm not entirely sure about that. The role genetics would play doesn't seem to be significant. Perhaps only incidental in the sense that melanin content is traceable to genotypes, then genetics would be a factor, I guess.

It also true that there are problems within the POOR community that are contributing to adverse outcomes. Issues like births out of wedlock and cultural problems discouraging educational achievement (i.e. "acting smart") should also be of "public interest".
Blame must be shared across the identities or things will be interpreted as hostile to specific identities. I'm sure you have observed what I'm talking about. I would imagine that poor Americans would also respond defensively here to an assertion of cultural problems, if people identified that way. Though, there's not much class consciousness in contemporary American politics. Public policies addressing cultural issues should be specific to the problems sought to be addressed and not have any class or race based criteria imo.