Why or why not?
Can we Reduce the World to it's Physical Systems?
Posts
Total:
34
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@Sum1hugme
do you mind elaborating as yes I have covered this topic before
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@Sum1hugme
I, too, am curious. Are there more systems on Earth evident than physical? And if there are more than physical [actually, I believe there are, but I'm not going to bother to prove it] systems, what might they be, and why would we want to arbitrarily reduce them to merely the physical manifestations of Earth?
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@Dr.Franklin
Well it seems like everything that exists is composed of something else as far down as we can examine. Is it reasonable to say the trend will probably continue down to a definite cause-and-effect?
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@Sum1hugme
It is also reasonable to say that the trend must continue down beyond cause and effect, to 0.
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@zedvictor4
Wym
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@Sum1hugme
What is "Wym"?
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@zedvictor4
"What do you mean"
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@Sum1hugme
Reduce - Become smaller or less in size, amount, or degree.
That implies that there is something beyond the physical, you are essentially assuming that there is more than what is most assuredly true. The burden of proof falls onto the person making the claim and because you aren't you don't have to prove it, but anyone who does make that claim would have to provide evidence of its existence. One could make the experience argument and argue that our experiences are somehow distinct from the actual act of doing it. There is no evidence to positively assert this position, and it purveys fallacious reasoning.
Perhaps they would assert a supernatural other realm, not a mental one, in that case, it is even less likely. Such as a supernatural thing happening would be, by the literal laws of physics, impossible. Not impossible in the sense of what people think of quantum particles like, impossible such as defintionally and necessarily opposite from the literal rules of this universe. Essentially what I'm saying is that the default position is thinking of a material universe as that what we have the evidence for. It is a thing you can easily prove, whereas all of these other realms....
There is no evidence that is valid or sound.
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@Theweakeredge
so you would say, "yes it is reasonable to assume the trend will continue."?
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@Sum1hugme
im sorry but i dont really understand
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@Dr.Franklin
What would you like me to clarify?
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@Sum1hugme
wjhat physical systems are
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@Dr.Franklin
"a physical system is any object or part of an object that can be analysed with the laws of physics."
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@Sum1hugme
Are you suggesting that there was always something?........Was there ever nothing?
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@zedvictor4
I'm just asking if everything that exists can be reduced down to a physical system.
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@Sum1hugme
What trend? Your question was:
Can we reduce the world to it's physical systems?
What trend are you talking about
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@Theweakeredge
See #4
Then yes.
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@Sum1hugme
Isn't everything that exists already a part of a physical system.
Basically, the evolution of matter within the constraints of physical laws.
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@zedvictor4
That is a good point, you've made a good point!
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@Sum1hugme
Can we Reduce the World to it's Physical Systems?
Sure, but only on one level. However it would never account for the full scope of experience, not even slightly.
why not?
Because the physical world is like the outermost scale covering the many layers beneath. It would be like reducing an onion to it's outer peal, not knowing the amount of layers beneath it.
When one studies the brain for example and believes that because we could detect activity within that brain we can reduce our conscious existence to merely that location lol, that's like hooking an electrical meter to a circuit board and believing that we can reduce the existence of electricity to that component because we can read and measure "activity" within it, and that somehow it is the circuit board creating the existence of electricity.
But we obviously know that a circuit board merely confines and restricts the flow of electricity to harness it for the use of that circuit, and does not create it.
Similarly observing the physical world and all its components does nothing to unravel the mysteries of our existence on every level. One reason to remain open-minded about spirituality and spiritual experience (which includes NDE's as well as paranormal activity) is because it's tapping into the deeper layers of what exists. Using a physical medium to study the physical layer is restricted to merely that one observation, and in doing so one cannot account for the dynamics of what exists.
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@EtrnlVw
Idk man, I went on a ghost hunt the other day and it was a bunch of crap.
Isn't everything that exists already a part of a physical system.
It is connected to the physical system of course, but the physical system is a single succession of several events. To build and construct the physical world and its components there first needs to be a process of manipulating energy into matter and form. But why would energy begin to generate, manipulate and create anything? the answer of course lies beneath the activity of energy. What is beneath the activity of energy, that's where we tap into the reality of the foundations of creation. What produces energy? why does it act as an intelligent force?
Conscious activity (awareness) generates energy, energy is then manipulated to create form. Therefore energy actually does not exist alone in and of itself, it co-exists with another proponent, that being awareness.
Every time you observe energy, you observe awareness. Every time you observe awareness you observe energy. Nowhere does something exist where both energy and awareness are not present. It is the succession of events of these two properties that connects all things.
Basically, the evolution of matter within the constraints of physical laws.
But what is the evolution of matter lol? why does matter evolve? through what components? why do physical laws exist?
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@Sum1hugme
Lol, you have to have a specimen to observe. How do you plan on achieving that?
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@EtrnlVw
Wym when you say energy? because when I'm talking about energy I'm talking about a change in the physical state of a system that is reflected by another change in the physical state of a system
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@Sum1hugme
Wym when you say energy?
The very activity of energy, the measurement of energy. The quantified state of energy in every form or change.
a change in the physical state of a system
I'm addressing that change in that system.
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@EtrnlVw
Okay, but you don't need consciousness to create energy
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@Sum1hugme
Okay, but you don't need consciousness to create energy
Thanks for the speculation....so then you can account for why energy exists and why it generates processes I presume?
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@Sum1hugme
you don't need consciousness to create energy
Actually energy is not created, it is generated by conscious activity. Energy in return is manipulated to create form. Energy co-exists with awareness in other words. Neither are created and both eternal.