drooping stick.
The police are not going to tell the pissant numpty conservitard cowards that what a hood says is frightening and they will as usual kick the hoods arses. But you hide under your bed to prove how brave you are. I laugh.
No go areas in the UK
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@Stephen
What can you teach about homosexuality?
Not wanting to enter a neighbourhood because you feel threatened by brown people having the audacity to sit around and be all brown without apologizing does not make it a no go zone.
This is suggesting Islam is not peaceful.Islam under the definition of peaceful: without violence (https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/peaceful) is not peaceful.
I don't understand. Just keep it simple, why should "I dislike Islam". I want prosser to understand why it is that YOU say I "should dislike islam".
My claim was that the organizer does not even have children in the school. You didn't rebut that.
i don't care. It matters not to me or what I have said if or not this prick has children that attend that school. The point is, that it is muslims protesting about something that conflicts with their religion and are demanding the school adheres to their religious belief and way of life.
Should we know hate all Muslims because of a minority now?
well I haven't mentioned that I hate anyone concerned with this protest. The point I have made more than fkn once now is that it is MUSLIMS that are demanding THEIR islamic laws be upheld in a free western liberal society. Now if you cannot grasp that, just fk off and leave the thread because you will only be going around in circles all by yourself. I will add this though. the hypocray from the left and the homosexual community has been nothing short of astounding. these little homsexual cowards have not had the balls to come out in support of this headteacher and her staff. they haven't came out in a face to face protest against these muslims as they would if it was a Christian protest. No. if this was a Christian protest the left wing homsexuals would be there confronting the Christians and spitting in their faces and calling them homophobes. And the police wouldn't bat a fkn eyelid.
Don't be a fence sitter and act like there is bad but when you have to act upon bad you aren't going to do something about it. So what do we do about it? Please do answer so I understand what you want to happen.
I am not a fence sitter you nobhead.
There are fkn laws in this country that ALL residents must adhere to. So, leaving aside that these muslims have a right to protest, for whatever reason, they do not have the right to threaten and intimidate staff and members of the public who are defying the protesters by taking their children to the school.. In this case the law should be upheld and those threats of murder and rape should be thoroughly investigated by the police. But just like Rotherham and HUNDREDS of other places throughout the UK these allegations will be swept under the carpet as if nothing happened and you will not hear a damn thing ever again about them. I hope that covers it.
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@Stephen
You don't dislike Islam you hate Muslims and you are a liar.
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@Wylted
No go zones are a fact. The arguments liberals use against them amount to "no official no go zones are documented by the government". Well no shit. Police are not going to openly admit they are afraid to go to a location without significant back up
"No go zones" are a fact all over Europe. The apologist just don't want to admit it . It will all backfire on them sooner or later as the protests on homsexualiy are proveing.
Recently we have had the perfect demonstration in our own parliament of how the looney far left and open border idiots and the homosexual community are completely at odds with themselves. They have been trying for years now to make the incompatible - compatible and now it has come back to bit them on the arse simply because they cannot face up to the reality of it all.
Angela Eagle the lesbian MP British Labour Party stood up in parliament recently a cried her fkn eyes out about muslims, protesting outside schools in Birmingham.
What she cannot understand is that the ultimate issue here is not the homosexual aspect of it all, it is about muslims demanding what they believe are their rights in a democratic, free liberal country and laying down the law in opposition to the open free and liberal society that we all are supposed to live in. Eagle and her cohorts the left wing labour party have created this society that they themselves have found themselves to be at odds with.
Angela Eagle was wailing telling parliament " we are not going back into the closet". what this left wing dumb arse cannot see is that if labour actually get into power , and the law caves in to these muslim protester , back into the closet is exactly where she will be going. She must have forgotten that her own leader celebrates the Islamic Republic of Iran. The Islamic Republic of Iran publicly hangs homosexuals and leaves them hanging there as a warning to others. She is in complete denial and believes " we are all alike" . Between sobs and wails, she spoke about how "religion was not going to push her back into the closet", but she didn't mention which religion because she believes it is a religious problem generally but it isn't.
These are not Christian outside these schools she is wailing about, they are muslims who are protesting and getting their own way. One of these schools has now dropped the no outsiders programm and one teacher has ' resigned, but eagle is still is insisting that this a religious problem generally. She obviously hasn't seen the states that tell us that 52% in the UK of muslims believe that homosexuality should be criminalised. 100% of muslims in the Uk and polled by gallup said that they found homsexuality unacceptable and abhorrant. That is Zero tollerance of homsexuality, ( I wonder how many were "moderate".) But Eagle is in complete denial that this has anything at all to do with Islam. Why? because just like prosser , they have been defending Islam far too long to admit that they are also have been part of the fkn problem that they have caused and got it so , so fkn wrong.
Then we have another MP who now finds herself in a similar situation. Jessica Rose Phillips another British Labour Party member who told the world that the "rapes and sexual assalts in Cologne were no more different to a Friday night out in Birmingham".
Muslims in Birmingham are now putting up posters around the city calling for a vote of no confidence, because she wouldn't back the protests outside the schools. They want her scalp, and she now has began to realise what she and her party have caused. They are telling her what they will and will not accept and have called her an "islamophobe", YES! they have hit her with her own fkn stick and no one is more pleased than i. I will give her one thing, she attempted to tell these protesters that they will not be treated different to anyone else, it got her nothing but abuse.
But still, for reasons explained above, these pair of left wing libtards and people such as the apologist prosser still refuse to see what is happening.
I have linked to much of what I have explained below.
The Birmingham school and imported gay hate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56vzk...
Muslims in Britain have zero tolerance of homosexuality, says poll https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/m...
Half of all British Muslims think homosexuality should be illegal, poll finds https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...
'We aren't getting back in the closet' says Angela Eagle in impassioned LGBT speech https://www.theguardian.com/politics/...
Jess Phillips targeted by Birmingham anti-LGBT protesters https://talkradio.co.uk/news/jess-phi...
Labour MP Jess Phillips defends remarks about Cologne sex attacks https://www.theguardian.com/world/201...
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@Stephen
Are you aware what an 'apologist' is?
Apologetics (from Greek ἀπολογία, "speaking in defense") is the religious discipline of defending religious doctrines through systematic argumentation and discourse.
As I have pointed out elsewhere, Yassine is an example of an Islamic apologist, but I am not.
keith was married to a Muslim. It's why it is the only religion he gives any support to. Arguing with him about it is pointless. Save your precious time on something else.
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@Stephen
@Ramshutu
@disgusted
@TheRealNihilist
Why? because just like prosser , they have been defending Islam far too long to admit that they are also have been part of the fkn problem that they have caused and got it so , so fkn wrong.
It gets really boring to keep on repeating that I am not a defender of Islam. In my thread 'why is islam backward' I wrote
But in the islamic world a narrow, fundamentalistic attitude to scripture developed centuries ago is still going strong, and (some would contend) only getting stronger, to the detriment of everbody (especially Muslims).
I then provided a link to a piece that discussed the poor prospects of reform in Islam. Islam is backward in its attitude towards gays, women, science - you name it. These are matters on which Stephen and I (and gus) surely agree.
So why the mutual animosity? Bluntly, if I see someone pouring petrol on a fire my instinct is to stop him! Then maybe the fire will not get out of control. But because I don't co-operate in his patriotic crusade against Islam and Moslems he brands me an 'islamic apologist'.
Clearly when young muslims are inspired to mow down strangers with a rented van something has gone horribly wrong. There are Muslim equivalents of Steve whipping also up tribal hate, using more or less the same tricks of half-truth and emotional rhetoric. Steve has more in common with a radical Imam than he may realise.
I am making it as clear as I possibly can. Islam bad. You should dislike bad. Is that okay? I have clearly laid out why as well.I don't understand. Just keep it simple, why should "I dislike Islam". I want prosser to understand why it is that YOU say I "should dislike islam".
i don't care. It matters not to me or what I have said if or not this prick has children that attend that school. The point is, that it is muslims protesting about something that conflicts with their religion and are demanding the school adheres to their religious belief and way of life.
Did you actually watch the video? It was also reported Christian and Jewish groups were also helping or maybe you Muslim dislike overshadow in comparison to Christians and Jews who are acting on the same thing as in demanding a change in the school.
The point I have made more than fkn once now is that it is MUSLIMS that are demanding THEIR islamic laws be upheld in a free western liberal society.
What should we do about it? Try and actually tell me what to do instead of doing what you always do which is have the courage to lay out the problem but to much of a coward to say what to do about it as in prevent it occurring.
the hypocray from the left and the homosexual community has been nothing short of astounding.
A right winger. Now I even think less of you.
I am not a fence sitter you nobhead.
Preach from a moral authority but when it comes to action you are still sitting on the fence. Who would have known the person furiated about the problem doesn't actually have a solution. What a waste of time.
There are fkn laws in this country that ALL residents must adhere to.
What laws did they break?
In this case the law should be upheld and those threats of murder and rape should be thoroughly investigated by the police. But just like Rotherham and HUNDREDS of other places throughout the UK these allegations will be swept under the carpet as if nothing happened and you will not hear a damn thing ever again about them. I hope that covers it.
Maybe just maybe like the Rotherham case they are do it in private. They are upholding the law. It is not like the US where I think majority of court cases are public. It is the UK and they choose to make the Rotherham case to done in a private court. If you have a problem protest for public trails so that your buddy Tommy Robinson doesn't get jailed for being an idiot like what he did was confront the very people who were in the trial. Under no circumstances was Tommy allowed to influence the decision. He was there and as a prominent figure he had a duty to remain as distant as possible instead of doing what he did which was not keep his distance and caused an altercation. Doubtful you don't like Tommy because you have admitted you are a right winger and dislike Muslims.
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@keithprosser
I'm more than happy to not use the word 'moderate' if you suggest an alternative. There are Muslims who want to establish a world Caliphate and are prepared to use violence and force to achieve it. There are "muslims who actually do want to actually live in a peaceful integrated western society." - at least in theory!We need labels to discuss the issue. In the west non-muslims have adopted 'Islamist' and 'Moderate' for that purpose. Many Muslims do not like those terms, for reasons I gave earlier.So please do uggest term for the different sorts of Islam and their followers - they may catch on! But I don't expect many Muslims to read my posts, so I will stick with 'islamist/ihdist/fanatical' etc for one sort and 'moderate' for the other.
- Or just, Muslims.
I've @ed Yassine to see if we can get our resident Muslim's view!
- All this is entirely irrelevant. A good chunk of Christians hold the most aggressive views (in my estimate far more than Muslims), which they are not particularly designated for -at least in their world. The overwhelming majority of wars -& deaths- in this century or the past century (or any century) were instigated by Christians, yet all they see is the aggression of others... For every Muslim that holds such views, 10 Christians hold worse views. Just scroll through this Forum & take notice of their attitude & tone, complete utter callousness. Our friend Stephen is a prime example. At least the Muslim side is understandable, given the immense suffering & humiliation they endured.
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@Yassine
I am the only Orthodox Christian here. You should not take the deviations of heretics as being representative of Christianity.
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@Mopac
I am the only Orthodox Christian here. You should not take the deviations of heretics as being representative of Christianity.
- It is indeed a sad fact that Western Christianity took the lead in most Christian history. The world would look so much different if Eastern Christianity prevailed.
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@Yassine
The Orthodox Catholic Church is the second largest congregation of Christians on the planet.
Despite being subjected to Muslim dhimmitude in the middle east and Africa for a good chunk of its history.
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@Yassine
It is most definiterly not irrelevant. There are social tensions between communities in the UK and europe and people are dieing at the hands of radicals and fanatics on both sides. Is it 'irrelevant' that young men are being motivated and radicalised to commit murders in the name of Islam? Is it irrelevant that non-Muslims murder Muslims in retaliation, as in new zealand a few weeks ago?All this is entirely irrelevant
And all you can do is bad mouth christians! Is that supposed to help? In what way does that promote peace? Are you better than Steve or of the same vile type intolerant bigot that causes ordinary men and women to die for nothing, sacrificed as pawns by ideologically driven fanatics?
Christians and Muslims profess love and peace, but it seems that it is me, an atheist, that is the only one here working for reconciliation.
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@Mopac
The Orthodox Catholic Church is the second largest congregation of Christians on the planet.Despite being subjected to Muslim dhimmitude in the middle east and Africa for a good chunk of its history.
- Under which they flourished & lasted. If Muslims had adopted a secular-like system or a Christian-like system, there will hardly be any Orthodox christians today.
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@keithprosser
It is most definiterly not irrelevant. There are social tensions between communities in the UK and europe and people are dieing at the hands of radicals and fanatics on both sides. Is it 'irrelevant' that young men are being motivated and radicalised to commit murders in the name of Islam? Is it irrelevant that non-Muslims murder Muslims in retaliation, as in new zealand a few weeks ago?
- Exactly why the designation is irrelevant. It is but a meaningless ignorant label with no substance whatsoever. Man is enemy of what he does not know. The solution is simple & easy, but systematically unattainable -& partially because of these stupid fanciful labels.
And all you can do is bad mouth christians! Is that supposed to help? In what way does that promote peace? Are you better than Steve or of the same vile type intolerant bigot that causes ordinary men and women to die for nothing, sacrificed as pawns by ideologically driven fanatics?
- LOL! Straw-man! I forgot that part where you were talking about 'moderate' Christians & 'fanatical' christianists... My point was clear, the very designation 'moderate' is a joke, for reasons cited. Intolerance is but a symptom of ignorance & arrogance, which anyone is susceptible to.
Christians and Muslims profess love and peace, but it seems that it is me, an atheist, that is the only one here working for reconciliation.
- Love & Peace are first & foremost a spiritual state & a mental realization, which comes with persistent struggle & self-discipline within oneself. As a Muslim, from God all things come & to him all things belong, the world & all in it -all I must accept. This, however, should not impede judgement or compromise belief, what is wrong is wrong & what is right is right -be it from Muslims or Christians.
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@Yassine
Mohammed and his successors were heads of a secular government. Secular means worldly. Clearly, the caliphate was a Kingdom of this world.
And there is nothing about Muslim rule that has been conducive to flourishing for us. Preventing us from building churches and monasteries, confiscating churches, preventing us from preaching publically, killing Muslim converts to Christianity... tip of the iceburg stuff.
But as The Lord Jesus Christ said to those who crucified Him, "Forgive them, for they know not what they do."
And I hold no animosity towards Muslims. I do not believe that Mohammad was a prophet though, as his teachings concerning Jesus Christ are contrary to what the church has always believed since the beginning.
And there is nothing about Muslim rule that has been conducive to flourishing for us. Preventing us from building churches and monasteries, confiscating churches, preventing us from preaching publically, killing Muslim converts to Christianity... tip of the iceburg stuff.
But as The Lord Jesus Christ said to those who crucified Him, "Forgive them, for they know not what they do."
And I hold no animosity towards Muslims. I do not believe that Mohammad was a prophet though, as his teachings concerning Jesus Christ are contrary to what the church has always believed since the beginning.
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@Wylted
No go zones are a fact. The arguments liberals use against them amount to "no official no go zones are documented by the government". Well no shit. Police are not going to openly admit they are afraid to go to a location without significant back up
- Reminds me of those 'Patriot' groups in their no-go-zones... Black ghettos in their gang territories too I guess.
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@keithprosser
But because I don't co-operate in his patriotic crusade against Islam and Moslems he brands me an 'islamic apologist'.
That is because you are, you play down the actions of MUSLIMS at every chance. You are no better than that leftwing libtard Jess Phillips MP who told the world that the rapes and sexual assaults in Cologne of hundreds of young women "where no different to a night out in Birmingham on a Friday night" <<<< this was libtard Philips trying to play down the fact that these rapes and sexual assaults were caused by left wing immigration policy.
And YOU are no fkn different to that left wing apologist Jess Phillips. You have claimed that one the Teachers at centre of the homosexual row in Birmingham simply resigned from his post after being harassed by "christian parents" , when the teacher himself says it was the "death threats from MUSLIMS and after a police warning concerning his safety that FORCED him to leave. These warnings are not dished out for nothing, they are official Osman Warnings IN WRITING! you fkn apologist.
I REPEAT!!!!
"Andrew Moffat says his lessons were not accepted by some Muslim parents, adding: "You can't teach someone to be gay"
"The teacher at the centre of the row over LGBT lessons has told Sky News he received a death threat and has been given advice from police about how he travels to and from school.
Andrew Moffat, the assistant head teacher at Parkfield Community School in Birmingham, wrote the No Outsiders programme that is used to teach diversity and equality in some schools."
Protests by mainly Muslim parents who object to their children learning about same-sex relationships have now spread from Parkfield to other schools in Birmingham and beyond".
I would say having received a death threat and warnings from the police concerning his safety, that this could be a classic case of being forced out of his job. But if you want to appease the the mob and play down the death threats you can call it "resigned" if you wish.
You played down the seriousness of this by (1) making it appear that it was Christians that had caused this teacher to "resign". (2) you have purposely played down the seriousness of this case by willfully omitting the death threats and the police warning that this teacher had received. You are a devious and sly person who knows the fkn truth of the matter but just like those two left wing labour libtard MP's you are in full blown denial.
Those two clowns are reaping what they have fkn sown, the problem with that though is , so will everyone else. so fk you again proseer you lying devious bastard!
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@Mopac
Mohammed and his successors were heads of a secular government. Secular means worldly. Clearly, the caliphate was a Kingdom of this world.
- It absolutely is. A caliph is, by all means, a secular ruler. The Prophet (pbuh) obviously isn't.
And there is nothing about Muslim rule that has been conducive to flourishing for us.
- Umm? Having your own lands? You own leaders? Your own laws? Financial independence?... If it had been a Secular rule, you'd simply be subject to the rule of the majority, laws & leaders not yours, living among a Muslim majority, losing your religion & customs & culture, quickly going extinct.
Preventing us from building churches and monasteries, confiscating churches, preventing us from preaching publically, killing Muslim converts to Christianity... tip of the iceburg stuff.
- Propaganda nonsense. Almost *all* Churches that exist in the Middle East today were built under Muslim rule. Yes, as were Muslims prohibited to preach publicly to Christians. & unless those Muslims did more than just convert to Christianity, I assure you they were safe. & history is filled with such cases. Pick any history book. Why don't you tell me about the whole ice-burg.
But as The Lord Jesus Christ said to those who crucified Him, "Forgive them, for they know not what they do."
- Now, that is a beautiful thing to say.
And I hold no animosity towards Muslims. I do not believe that Mohammad was a prophet though, as his teachings concerning Jesus Christ are contrary to what the church has always believed since the beginning.
- As I hold none towards Christians, especially Eastern christians. Personally, I feel that Eastern christians belong with us Muslims as natural brothers, as opposed to Western christians, who I feel are distant.
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@Stephen
Why don't you and your fascist mates go down and sort it, oh whiteman warrior?
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@Yassine
You really underestimate our faith. Christianity does not need the protection of a state to live. If this was the case, The Roman Empire would have stamped out Christianity before becoming Christian 300 years after pentecost.
Islam thrives in an environment that silences anything that disagrees with it. If The Church were truly given liberty, and Muslims were not threatened with death for converting, Orthodox Christianity would truly flourish in the middle east.
It is our duty as Christians to preach the gospel. To prevent us from freely preaching the gospel is to oppose God. It matters not if Muslims are not allowed to try to convert us. Indeed, if they tried, and found themselves being the ones converted, they put themselves in danger! And surely, The Church is no stranger to this. We recognize many Muslims who became Orthodox as saints, after being discovered, refusing to renounce their faith under threats of death that were not empty.
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@Stephen
I work with peaceful integrated Muslims on a daily basis.
There will always be intolerant people, in all societies.
Just take a look at all the Christian nut jobs in the U.S.
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@zedvictor4
Intolerance and Christianity are not compatible.
In fact, we are taught a step above simply tolerating others. We are taught charity. That is, loving those who are tolerated, not simply putting up with them.
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@keithprosser
There are Muslims who want to establish a world Caliphate and are prepared to use violence and force to achieve it.
Yes It's called Islamic terrorism or more precise, Islamic jihad. See Manchester Bombings for a description.https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3627708/manchester-arena-bombing-victims-terror-attack-ariana-grande-anniversary/
There are "muslims who actually do want to actually live in a peaceful integrated western society." - at least in theory!
Yes I said that, and believe it to be true. Don't you? What's you boring apologetic point!
We need labels to discuss the issue.
We do, but no sooner do I use the label MUSLIM to describe who is doing what to whom and where, then YOU and the sea sponge fire in with "labels" of your own calling me a "racist islamophobe". all very odd considering the sea sponge that is disgusted has "labeled" ALL muslims as mental cases and in serious and urgent need of psychiatric treatment and that Islam is stupid and Allah and the prophet Muhammad all have mental issues<<<<< How's that for "islamophobiia" !!!!??? and YOU telling us all " Why Islam is backward".
So please do uggest term for the different sorts of Islam and their followers - they may catch on!
Don't try to throw this back onto me you sly fkr. You have suggested yourself that there are "types" of muslim and "types" of Islam. YOU insist on using the label "moderate muslim" and YOU have also used the label "ordinary muslim" all on this thread of yours here >. Why Is Islam Backward? https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/1707
I have asked you repeatedly to explain what these terms mean. I will ask you again:
What is a "moderate muslim"?
What "types of Islam" are there?
What is an "ordinary muslim"?
I have also asked you three times to tell me if the MUSLIMS in this video are what you would call "moderate Muslims"? This will be the forth.
Moderate Muslims try to defend the death penalty for apostasy, adultery, homosexuality
It is a simple yes or no question. You it seems know what a "moderate muslims" is (although you have never explained it). So a simply yes or no will do.
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@Mopac
Intolerance and Christianity may not be compatible.
But there will always be intolerant people in all societies. it's an unavoidable social reality.
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@zedvictor4
Unfortunately. Charity must even be showed to these, for they know not what they do.
Yep.
As long as the moderate voice continues to outweigh the extreme voice.
Though history tells us that it only needs one charismatic nut and the balance can be tipped.
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@zedvictor4
There is nothing moderate about what Christ taught. We who follow Him are by nature radicals.