Am I A Christianophobe?

Author: Stephen

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#1
Stephen
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There are many here who are quick to label anyone criticizing Islam, the quran and muslims  as islamophobic and racists bigots.  But I have yet to be labeled an Christianophobic racist  bigot with an irrational and uncontrollable fear or dread  (which is the correct definition of a phobic person) when I  criticise Christianity / Christians for believing much of the superstitious nonsense that they have been taught. And no mention of me spreading fear and \hatred.
Or when I have criticised  The New Testament for its half truths, false stories, its enigmatic and ambiguous verses and for calling it extremely flawed. 

I haven't been called a Christianophobia racist bigot when I have criticised the Old Testament  when calling it a war book where mankind is controlled by a warmongering psychotic and schizophrenic jealous  god and his human cohorts and also for its superstitious nonsense. Or have I been accused of spreading hatred and fear although I have been accused of some kind of being on some kind of "radicalisation" mission.





#2
keithprosser
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@Stephen
I get the impression that your heart isn't really as into being anti-Christian as it is when you are being anti-Isamic!

people who want to criticise islam have to face up to the problem that much criticism of islam is motivated by racism and xenophobia - the sort of person who formerly filled the ranks of the NF and BNP are now on the anti-islam wandwagon.   Frankly, you frequently come over as an old fashioned racist, just replacing coloured people with muslims.

I don't mean you come over that way to me - it's the way you come over to everyone on DArt and that is why you get accused of being an islamophoe but not a christianophobe.   To avoid it, find a different style.  Or don't change style and continue to be thought of as a bigoted racist - it's your choice.

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Snoopy
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@Stephen
Do you think Christians pose a threat to you, your people, or your country?  
#4
Outplayz
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@Stephen
warmongering psychotic and schizophrenic jealous  god
God's like that because humans created it. 

Anyways... i wouldn't say you have a phobia. I don't think you would run out of a room just bc some religious person is there. My entire law firm, except me, are Christians. Honestly, i play it off pretty good... i feel like a little devil bc they think i agree. That's life. A phobic couldn't do that, and i think you would do better than me in the law office with all of your knowledge. Which second point, your well read. A phobic probably couldn't touch the Bible... i'm a little phobic in that sense that i feel weird walking into a church. 

Bigot... well, why is that so bad? Intolerant to something fake that is controlling the minds and our world with such bs. What you said up there... the world find a psychopathic god to be the way... no wonder corporations are feeding us politicians that they agree with...Fck the people right? But people just eat up if one person says i'm "Christian." I think we kinda have a right to be intolerant of such a religion that dresses everyone wolf in sheep's clothing. Are you a bigot towards the people? I don't think so... i think you'd love to sit down and have a talk with someone that's one of these religions. Your temperament might be different than mine... bc i'll just end it saying "maybe you're right." Just not to piss someone off... i don't know you. But i suspect (in person) you'd do that. Over the internet, we just don't have to be that nice. But... if i catch one of the theists in another forum on a subject we agree... i'd talk to them fine. Haven't looked through you stuff... but i don't think you hold grudges. Except... some people are just trash, bc they're trash... not bc of their faith. 

All in all... i don't think you are. I know i used myself a bit too, just to double down you know... so people don't think i'm hatin on them. But, from what i can tell... you ain't bad. I mean, i think i told you i favor spirituality and the platform and you really didn't care bc it didn't have baggage. I think you're just lambasting religions that deserve it. It's a good read... so keep doing you're thing. 
#5
Outplayz
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@Snoopy
People no... the religion, yes. 
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#6
Stephen
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@keithprosser
I get the impression that your heart isn't really as into being anti-Christian as it is when you are being anti-Isamic!

 I am not anti Christian and I don't fear Christianity.  I have absolutely no reason to . So you, jumping to conclusions have started off on the wrong foot already and made a wrong opinion of me without a single piece of evidence.. . I simply have problems with the Bible (the NT in particular) in the way that it has come down to us and in the way it has been taught to us.

people who want to criticise islam have to face up to the problem that much criticism of islam is motivated by racism and xenophobia -

Opinion. A typical opinion of apologist such as yourself who have never been able to produce a counter argument so simply default to the same old shite.. But let's stick to the point of the thread.

I don't believe that I suffer from "christianophobia" and I  am amazed that considering  my criticism of Christianity far far out ways my criticism of Islam yet no one has accused me of being a racist bigot who is spreading hate, and fear and division when it comes to Christianity,   although I have been accused of of running a " petty little indoctrination class" when I  criticise and question Christianity.  



the sort of person who formerly filled the ranks of the NF and BNP are now on the anti-islam wandwagon.  

Opinion again, prosser.
Veiled insults and accusations about someone you know absolutely nothing about.Get off the thread you buffoon or answer the question.  This thread is about "christianophobia" and not for you to start spreading your veiled hate and division.  

Frankly, you frequently come over as an old fashioned racist, just replacing coloured people with muslims.
Yes you have said similar before. So I will ask you again to produce the evidence for your accusations. But look closely at what you have wrote above there. This is you trying your hardest to squeeze a argument for racism out of an impossibility. It doesn't work, and this is why there are leftist liberal apologists such as yourself  are in the process of attempting to change the English language so it that will support your argument. See here>>https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/1527


I don't mean you come over that way to me -
 "not me, not me".  You have changed your tune. Sounds like backpedaling and or just outright lies. You have made your opinion of me extremely clear on many occasions even going as far to accuse me of "radicalisation" of  people to the far right, so away with your pretense of  - in the name of fairness and diplomacy.. 


it's the way you come over to everyone on DArt

Everyone? so you speak for all members then?




and that is why you get accused of being an islamophoe but not a christianophobe. 

Yes, accused by you and 1 or 2 others.  And I do have the evidence for that accusation should you wish to see it despite your denials above.

Like I have said, I have criticized Christianity and the New Testament far far  more that I ever have Islam:
See here>>>.https://www.debateart.com/participants/Stephen/forum_topics?page=6<<<<<  26 to 5, but you don't seem to mind that. No, you have had no qualms at all, and  have never accused me  of being racist, spreading hate and division or of being Christianophobic, there have you? 

 You don't mind it being open season on the subject of  Christianity, but woe betide anyone who criticises Islam. That behaviour is nothing short of blatant left wing liberal bias that shouldn't have a place on any forum. You must have shares in the website, as I have seen no criticism of you for your obvious bias. Your not a mod here as well are you? I wouldn't be surprised.




  To avoid it, find a different style.  Or don't change style and continue to be thought of as a bigoted racist -
By you. Yes I know. but I am neither of those you accuse me of being. But you're entitled to your opinion as long as you can support that opinion when accusing people of things they are not. Having an opinion of things/ideas is far far different than to having an opinion of people. You should keep that in mind

it's your choice.

I know that too.

So, can you now answer the question, am I Christianophobic?  

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Stephen
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@Snoopy
Do you think Christians pose a threat to you, your people, or your country?  

You may not realize it but that is a tricky question.
 If a Christian Western country attacked the U.K. (another Christian country) in the name of Christianity and or a god/Christ of the "Christian religion" then without doubt I would think that. But you see, WWI & WWII were not religious wars to my knowledge.

So am I a "Christianophobe" because I have started over 25 threads on this forum criticising and questioning Christianity and the bible?
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@Stephen
If you don't presently even have a reason to fear Christianity, nor do you fear it, I think we can rule out an irrational, uncontrollable fear in your case.
#9
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@Outplayz
Okay, so when you say the religion, do you mean that you fear the religion of Jesus, or are you talking about something else, like organized efforts in the name of God.  I think one is a fear of Christianity, the way, and the latter pertains more to fear of the Christian identity. Mirroring islamophobia I would assume that christianphobe in this context would refer to the way, since Islam designates a faith and the people are called Muslims.  Hopefully I'm not boxing you in with this line of questioning.  Feel free to elaborate.
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@keithprosser
the sort of person who formerly filled the ranks of the NF and BNP are now on the anti-islam wandwagon.   Frankly, you frequently come over as an old fashioned racist, just replacing coloured people with muslims.
In other words, they are "white".  White racism is a relatively common occurrence in my experience.  That doesn't mean that I should address you as a racist.  That's incredibly rude and unwarranted.  Islam is not a race either, so the cognitive dissonance puts you at risk of impairing your address to any real social problems, if that's the intent.

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#11
Stephen
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@Snoopy
If you don't presently even have a reason to fear Christianity, nor do you fear it, I think we can rule out an irrational, uncontrollable fear in your case.

I don't. Which is exactly what I have said at post #6 above. That is a no then. Yet I have treated Islam with no more favours than I have Christianity.  In fact I have criticized and questioned the New Testament (and the old) more vigorous and more often than Islam,  only to be accused of racism, spreading fear and hatred, being bigoted and of causing division and being phobic towards it. The hypocrisy and double standards shown by some here are quite amazing at times.



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#12
Stephen
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@Snoopy
the sort of person who formerly filled the ranks of the NF and BNP are now on the anti-islam wandwagon.   Frankly, you frequently come over as an old fashioned racist, just replacing coloured people with muslims.
  Islam is not a race either,



It isn't and this is why there are leftist liberal apologists that are in the process of attempting to change the English language so it that will support (fit)  their argument. See here>>https://www.debateart.com/forum/topics/1527 . They want to be able to say that Islam is a race and tell us that we are being racist because we fearing irrationally people of a race and not a religion itself... This is nothing more than a cynical attempt to gag and criminalise free speech in the name of hate speech and give Islam a free ride and immunity, where as it is open season on any other religion. Don't these apologist just make you sick.
#13
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@Stephen
Racism is relatively simple to rule out as unreasonable so that was an easy in, but religion and politics as can be observed in this website are often considered to be highly debatable subjects.  At some point in this thread we would have to act to the effect of ascertaining which fears are unreasonable.  It should be obvious why governments should not have this power by now.  In America, that's considered to be in the jurisdiction of the church, which is separate from the jurisdiction of government.  If you don't separate the church and government, you could wind up corrupting both.

#14
keithprosser
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@Snoopy
religion and politics as can be observed in this website
old-fshioned racism happens here too.

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#15
Stephen
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@Snoopy
Racism is relatively simple to rule out as unreasonable

You would have thought so, Snoopy.  But it doesn't stop them trying at any and every opportunity, even when  accusations of racism & bigotry comes veiled in  lines such as:

"you come over as an old fashioned racist, just replacing coloured people with muslims  [but] I don't mean you come over that way to me". 
That above is an accusation of racism veiled in fake politeness and a distancing from the actual accusation, if ever I heard one.


And this:
just replacing coloured people with muslims 
Do you see how a faith almost morphs and becomes a race . This is intentional. They do not understand the damage they do when they attempt this linguistic alchemy.

It is much easier for the apologist to default to accusations of "racism and bigotry" even in the realms of the religious debate when all else fails. 

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@Snoopy
Do you think Christians pose a threat to you, your people, or your country?  
Christianity has been a threat to people for centuries. It causes conflict, ignorance and hatred. When will mankind rid us of this plague?

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#17
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@Goldtop
Christianity has been a threat to people for centuries. It causes conflict, ignorance and hatred. 

It has caused all three. 

When will mankind rid us of this plague?
The only way is to be able to discuss it openly showing it for what it is with all its flaws exposed but without fear of imprisonment and or death and accusations of racism bigotry which one can  do when it comes to exposing and criticizing Christianity  By allowing such debate and criticism the flaws can be exposed and people will be left to choose and make up their own minds as has been slowly happening in the western world.

But it appears that this can only happen with all religions except Islam.

#18
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@Stephen
It's all about projection, Stephen. They are simply projectng their own hatred onto you for criticizing their irrational faith.
#19
Snoopy
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@Goldtop
Pending an extensive international genocide which is going to take a lot of time and coordination, I am not able to come up with a way to eliminate Christianity, so you will probably have to cope with it for the remainder of your life.  I think on a macro level, the more stress that is placed on it, the stronger it will get.  Once it gets big and easy, there will tend to be a larger proportion of cultural "Christians" and whatnot.

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Goldtop
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@Snoopy
an extensive international genocide, I am not able to come up with a way to eliminate Christianity
It's funny how you Christians believe that illiminating a bad ideology requires the illimination of the people who follow it. Did the Soviet people get illiminated when Communism was illiminated? Seriously dude.

you will probably have to cope with it for the remainder of your life
Yes, that is unfortunate. You are able to wallow in the freedom of religion while I'm enslaved to it.

the more stress that is placed on it, the stronger it will get.
That's why education of children is very important, they should be taught the tools of critical thinking before they are taught religions, but unfortunately, that isn't the case, hence we have indoctrination into a very bad ideology.
#21
Outplayz
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@Snoopy
No. It all is contained in the fact that it's man-made. And bc it is, it's fallible. You have no clue that in 100 years those generations will start to think Jesus was wrong and that the old testament is much more serious. It also has the ability to turn good people into evil people. Even if those cases are smaller, it's bc it's flawed that it happens. Than there is the element of telling people they are powerless. This makes people into the perfect little slaves. That it's okay to bow down. That message is quite offensive. There should be no person or god we bow down to unless we meet them and establish enough respect to want to. 

When it comes to Jesus' teachings, whatever. I'm a good person and i know that bc people tell me i'm a good person. I really don't need to read about someone else's story to figure that out. From what i've read, Jesus seems like a cool dude... I like anyone that stands up to something they see as corrupt and i like that part of his story. But it's nothing i can't figure out or buy at the book store in the form of ethics or moral books. But even than, i get to pick in the end of the day how i want to live. Whether it's good or bad. I like to live both and i find that completely moral. I do bad things, i do good things. So even Jesus' story isn't the full truth for everyone. 

And, to tell other people they are going to hell bc they are a little bad or just bad... isn't something i think should be in the hearts of others. That creates humans that judge other humans. Who is to tell me i can't go out and dress like Satan to have an orgy? Everyone is consenting, and we're sharing love. Again, the Bible is flawed bc it's written by humans that found what they found to be good or bad. If two gay guys/girls want to use a 10 inch dildo on each other... what i say, "have freakin fun i'll see you tomorrow." Not... oh my, your going to hell if you don't repent... that's BS man-made opinions that further divides people into good or damned.  

All religion does, well not all of them bc i have more respect for some than others, all Abrahmic religions do is divide and teach people to give up their power. I think that's poison. I obviously don't disagree with everything in the Bible... i just disagree that the religion isn't flawed. I don't even necessarily think it's a bad thing... the community and all that is great... but, it's flawed bc humans created it which is why these negatives will manifest. 
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#22
Stephen
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@Goldtop
It's funny how you Christians believe that illiminating a bad ideology requires the illimination of the people who follow it. 

It is also funny that when a bad ideology/religion is Illuminated and shown up for what it is, the faithful, instead of addressing the exposed problem,  believe it is a requirement to illuminate and shine a accusung  light on those that are exposing what is wrong with said ideology/religion. 
#23
Harikrish
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@Stephen

There are many here who are quick to label anyone criticizing Islam, the quran and muslims  as islamophobic and racists bigots.  But I have yet to be labeled an Christianophobic racist  bigot with an irrational and uncontrollable fear or dread  (which is the correct definition of a phobic person) when I  criticise Christianity / Christians for believing much of the superstitious nonsense that they have been taught. And no mention of me spreading fear and \hatred.
Or when I have criticised  The New Testament for its half truths, false stories, its enigmatic and ambiguous verses and for calling it extremely flawed.

I haven't been called a Christianophobia racist bigot when I have criticised the Old Testament  when calling it a war book where mankind is controlled by a warmongering psychotic and schizophrenic jealous  god and his human cohorts and also for its superstitious nonsense. Or have I been accused of spreading hatred and fear although I have been accused of some kind of being on some kind of "radicalisation" mission.

If you don't know what you are, you are not going to get any help from our members because they are too polite to tell you.

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#24
Stephen
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@Harikrish

you are not going to get any help from our members because they are too polite to tell you.

Not sure that is totally true because it has been made clear to me many times by some  " too polite members" here that they believe me to be an "islamophobe"  when I criticize and question Islam. No, these few " too polite members" haven't held back at all on that score and made their feeling extremely clear.

 Keeping in mind that I don't hate or fear Christianity in the slightest and I haven't been given the slightest no reason to;  It would be nice if you,Harikrish, or anyone else could define for me "christianophobia" or what it actually means for one to be "Christianophobic"? 
As I have often really gone to town on Christianity, by highlighting its contradictions, half stories, ambiguous verses, enigmatic statements and downright lies and  have often called the OT god a megalomaniac schizophrenic war god and tyrant,  but these so called " too polite members" have never labeled me a hate preaching, fear spreading"Christianophobe",   where as it doesn't take much for same  " too polite members" to get on their pompous, self righteous apologetic high horses at the first criticism of Islam . One member has gone so far as to call me his "enemy" and that I am not much different to "a jihadist". 

Here to help you is the definition of the word - Phobia.

phobia
/ˈfəʊbɪə/
noun

  1. an extreme or irrational fear of or aversion to something.

I will add that the far left liberal apologist are working on changing the centuries old English definition by defining Islam as a race. Thereby making the criticism  of a religion/ideology  a racist hate crime.The proposed definition reads as:

“Islamophobia is rooted in racism and is a type of racism that targets expressions of Muslimness or perceived Muslimness.”


"expressions of Muslimness"?? Nope , me neither.
#25
Melcharaz
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its not possible for an unregenerated person to fear the concept of christianity. It is possible to be afraid of the wrath of God, but that would mean you believed in God and that he has wrath on sinners.  no.  The ones who are really afraid are those who willfully blashemed the holy spirit and turned their back on God after recieving it and accepting forgiveness of sins.   Until then, the only way you will fear God is if you believe in him, or if he manifests himself.
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Stephen
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 Until then, the only way you will fear God is if you believe in him, or if he manifests himself.

I do admit above that:  I don't hate or fear Christianity in the slightest and I haven't been given the slightest no reason to. And I have said on many occasions that I believe that  these very  much flesh and blood "gods " actually existed. 


Can you define for me "christianophobia" or what it actually means for one to be "Christianophobic"? 
#27
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Malcharez sez...

Until then, the only way you will fear God is if you believe in him, or if he manifests himself.
Since the latter has never occurred, we are to act like small children and fear the boogieman under our beds.
#28
keithprosser
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@Stephen
 I don't hate or fear Christianity in the slightest and I haven't been given the slightest no reason to.
I think the real difference is not Christianity v Islam but between theocracy and secularism.  A Christian theocracy would be very like an islamic one, but fortunately for us in the west a full-blown Christian theocracy is almost inconceivable.  We see glimpse of what it might e like when we see Christian Fundamentalist attitudes to science and gender issues.   It seems to me that religion has 'hardened' over the lst few decades, both in the Christian world and in Islam.   As religions are human constructs there is no 'correct' interpretation of them; there are only prevalent interpreations.

In the islamic world the rough equivalent of Christian fundamentalism is Salafism or Wahhabism.  Such 'Conservative' interpreatations are heavily promoted by the Saudi regime which has massive wealth to put behind it.   But there is no more neccessity for islam to be fundamentalist than there is for Christianity to be fundamentalist - there have to be reasons why Salafism has gained influence in the last few decades.

Whatever the reasons are, it's not because Muslims have suddenly noticed some verses in the koran!

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#29
Stephen
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@keithprosser
Can you define for me "christianophobia" or what it actually means for one to be "Christianophobic"? 
#30
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@Stephen
Never heard of the word, but you did write "I don't hate or fear Christianity in the slightest" so I don't think you are a 'christianophobe'.


I'd be a little more sympathetic to you if you hadn't mistaken me trying to be objective for being a Islamic apologist.   I think you present things as an over-simple black/white affair.  That's what demagogues and rabble-rousers do.   The reality involves a complicated mish-mash of histrory, politics, economics, culture etc.. I will continue to point that out.   But if you find anything I have ever posted that is actually supportive of Islam I'd be jolly surprised!  

If i want over-simplifed non-analysis I can buy the daily mail.  I don't need to read it here.