Suggestion: Professional debates

Author: DebateArt.com

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Total: 46
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#1
DebateArt.com
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So I have this idea of implementing the concept of "professional" debates, in which case only chosen users become "professionals" and can participate in the "professional" debates against other "professional" users and only with "professional" voters and so on. Also I am thinking about canceling the ratings for the general debates and make it "professional" debates specific thing. This way general debates will be used for proving to have the skill and deserving to be "professional" or for general rap battles and silly debates and whatnot. It's a super raw idea but I wonder what you guys think about it?

I believe I brought something up like this before but this time I am thinking about putting my hands on it and actually start working on it.

#2
warren42
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@DebateArt.com
So essentially a two-tier system of debates, debaters, and judges?
#3
David
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@warren42
Pretty much.

This will kinda separate the professional debates from the rap battles. That way the good debates don't get burried in with a bunch of troll debates 
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#4
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@warren42
Pretty much, yeah. 
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#5
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This will kinda separate the professional debates from the rap battles. That way the good debates don't get burried in with a bunch of troll debates 
This
#6
RationalMadman
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@DebateArt.com
I would only agree if gang-voters can't ruin a debater. Magicaintreal completely hurt my rating in a severe manner by getting me a loss vs alec with 2 of his buddies.
#7
David
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@RationalMadman
This is part of our plan. We would create a professional voter team to vote on debates to ensure at least 3 quality RFDs per debate. We may have it set so that you can select open, judiciary, or professional votes. 
#8
Ramshutu
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I would be find for removing rankings for regular debates.

you may not want to do away with rankings entirely, but have professional debates earn more

i would also suggest the professional league has blind debates. IE:

You press a “debate” button on the professional debate page, you are automatically matched to another debater (who also pressed debate)- but you can’t chose who it is - nor the debate rule specifics - and you are assigned a random topic and side from a pool of topics.

Otherwise you may find some people would just pick the easier opponents and topics.






#9
David
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@Ramshutu
I like that. This is what edeb8 has. It's a (secret topic) and you can decide to do pro or con. It's computer generated. 
#10
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@David
In that case I support this but don't believe I should be excluded just because I noobsnipe and rap well.
#11
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@RationalMadman
You'd most likely be a part of it. You are certainly a strong debater on non-troll/non-rap topics. 

#12
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@DebateArt.com
As long as voters stay the same... it would be a good idea. People can already stipulate if they don't want certain people to vote and a lack of a good RFD will remove a vote, so i don't see any reason to not allow anyone to vote as long as they meet that criteria. The only other thing you can add to the votes, maybe, is that if the debater see's a bias vote or a grudge vote and can make their case why it is... then you can have mod action on that vote. 
#13
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@Outplayz
Lack of good RFD doesn't remove vote. It's toxic-liberal standards at the moment.
#14
Outplayz
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@RationalMadman
Well, a vote of mine was removed for lack of a good RFD. And, i actually did a decent job in explaining my vote. What i did wrong was only address one of the arguments. My reason was bc the rest were a tie in my opinion, so i didn't think it was necessary to bring it up.. but i guess i had to bring it up. It was an accurate vote otherwise. So... in my anecdotal experience, i'm under the impression it is enforced.  
#15
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@Outplayz
You don't know how to debate.
#16
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@RationalMadman
I've never debated here so that is a guess on your part. Did you mean i don't know how to vote? Bc i was aware of that fact... i just thought i could get away with it since it was a clear tie bw the other arguments. But i did mention to the debaters i had little time so my vote could not have been sufficient. I was well aware of that. I was just hoping no one reported it. So your assumptions are wrong all around. 
#17
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@Outplayz
What they did to you is not what they do to others scum on this site.
#18
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@RationalMadman
Well then, that should be an added mandatory review for professional debates... maybe they get priority over other reported votes, or there can be additional vote mods specifically for the Pro-Dees.   
#19
Death23
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@DebateArt.com
This way general debates will be used for proving to have the skill and deserving to be "professional" or for general rap battles and silly debates and whatnot
I see the trouble with rap battles and silly debates, but I don't see any need for users to prove themselves. Why would the latter be desirable?
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#20
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@Death23
I see the trouble with rap battles and silly debates, but I don't see any need for users to prove themselves. Why would the latter be desirable?
I think I expressed myself incorrectly, it's not even proving themselves but proving that they can take it seriously. If people truly try to do their best, if they don't forfeit the arguments and don't write obvious nonsense, don't show utter disrespect and etc, they deserve to be "professionals", even though they may lack the experience of debating per se but it shouldn't matter that much, the most important thing is showing due diligence to the process itself. 

At least that's how I see it.
#21
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@DebateArt.com
I think I expressed myself incorrectly, it's not even proving themselves but proving that they can take it seriously. If people truly try to do their best, if they don't forfeit the arguments and don't write obvious nonsense, don't show utter disrespect and etc, they deserve to be "professionals", even though they may lack the experience of debating per se but it shouldn't matter that much, the most important thing is showing due diligence to the process itself. 

At least that's how I see it.
It seems like, generally, you're looking for a way to improve the quality of the content generated by users in the debates and votes. The proposal strikes me as exclusionary without cause. Perhaps something like everyone gets a chance to engage in the professional debates but have higher standards for content and failing to meet those standards would subject users to being excluded from the professional debates for a time. Of course, account spamming might be a problem, but that may be addressed with account seasoning requirements.
#22
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@David
Fully support this idea. 
#23
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@David
Great idea! Would love to see it implemented.
#24
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@DebateArt.com
if i understand it, the idea is to have a closed group of members who indulge in 'serious' competitive debating amongst themselves.  I can see how that would appeal to a certain type of member and it doesn't prevent 'normal' members from carrying on as before.

There is only the matter of controlling the membership of the 'professional' sub-group unaddressed.

In passing, I think that commenting on debates should be removed.  Voting should be on the arguments presented - what purpose do the coments serve? 


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#25
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@keithprosser
There is only the matter of controlling the membership of the 'professional' sub-group unaddressed.
It would be controlled partially automatically and partially by some mods or trusted users. At least that's how I see it at the moment.

In passing, I think that commenting on debates should be removed.  Voting should be on the arguments presented - what purpose do the coments serve?
Comments are the means of communication in the scope of some specific debates, I am afraid, I don't understand why it would make sense to remove them.
#26
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@keithprosser
Totally bad and malicious suggestion.
#27
Alec
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@DebateArt.com
In your professional debate idea, since we're not getting paid, what if you called it "The Varsity debates" instead?

Also, would I be in the squad?  I'm currently ranked #4 on this site and I predict that since as of right now I have some easy wins coming in, and as of right now Virt has some losses coming in, I might be #2
#28
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@DebateArt.com
What would be your qualification for, "Varsity status" or "Professional status"?
#29
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@DebateArt.com
My argument is that a formal debate is supposed to be about the arguments presented as presented.  Too often the comments become a continuation of the debate, negating the formal structure.

Remarks on conduct and content can be placed in the vote RFD.   If people want a free-form debate on the issues beyond the material presented in the formal rounds then the forums is the place for it.
#30
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@Alec
I would argue ranking is irrelevant.   What matters is willingness to abide by 'debate etiquette' even if you have lost every debate so far.   Etiquette is hard to define by rules - to work the 'professional' group would have to operate according to the 'spirit' not the letter of its regulations.

That's fine...but it's for those who like to debate for debate's sake, which is not everyone.  If it keeps pedants and sticklers away from the rest of ns having our fun I'm all for giving 'profesionals' a sandpit to play in.