Should Prisoners Have to Work For Health Care in Prison?

Author: Reece101

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Reece101
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What’s your opinion? 
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@Reece101
Yep.

Prisoners should be put to work, period.


Reece101
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@zedvictor4
Is that a good incentive for corporations and governments to have? 
WyIted
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@zedvictor4
Prisoners should be put to work, period.
That's called slavery there white boy. Not sure why you guys always find excuse for slavery but it's unethical. 
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@zedvictor4
@Reece101
Prisoners should be put to work, period
Work is mandatory as productive citizen of society ergo, I  agree with Zed to some degree, however, I also believe there always exists migating factors of circumstances to consider beginning with the realities of widening gap between and the amount of medical care,

0 } ultra-rich and ultra-poor of a global humanity.

and the balancing or referencing the above, and each of the following to each other ergo, like so many issues, complexity always comes into play with any society, even those with less acsessing of empathy and compassion.

1} nature and degree of crime ---ex carrying weed, selling weed, carrying fentanyl or worse, selling fentanyl or worse--- terrorist attack with ergo no consideration of human life,  manslaughter i.e unintentional death in a bar { or other } fight breaks outs, etc,

2} type of medical being needed, ---bandaid, topical anti-biotic to prevent potential infection of a cut and degree of nasty circumstances it occurred in, vs MRI's, team of surgeons, extended rehabilitation with nurses etc,

3} nature of why --ie resultant of what circumstances of cause---   the medical is needed. Ex repeated breaking of safety rules, someone else is the causes for anothe's need for  medical care, etc,

4} in slavery days, there where those who understood the chance of better production of goods comes from more humane treatment of slaves, is my best guess.




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@WyIted
Prisoners should be put to work, period.
That's called slavery there white boy. Not sure why you guys always find excuse for slavery but it's unethical. 
Prisoners are so lucky.

I have to work to pay for my living expenses and health care, that is slavery too, it's unethical that I have to work for a living.


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@Sidewalker
Prisoners are so lucky.
The punishment for crime is free food!
Savant
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@WyIted
That's called slavery there
Some would call it community service
Shila
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@Best.Korea
Prisoners are so lucky.
The punishment for crime is free food!
Now you have found an incentive you were looking for.
Reece101
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If a prison has compulsory work, there should also be a voting system in place. 
Shila
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@Reece101
If a prison has compulsory work, there should also be a voting system in place. 
Those incarcerated lose their right to vote.
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@Shila
You don’t domesticate a caged animal by poking it with a stick. 
Shila
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@Reece101
You don’t domesticate a caged animal by poking it with a stick. 
No, you just take away their right to vote.
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@zedvictor4
@Reece101
 Yes prisoners should be put to work. Hell we need to bring back compulsory labor for civil debts. Right now somebody can screw you over terribly but if they have nothing to take you get no recompense.

For example squatters can hide in your house for 10 months lying about and forging leases. They trash the place, costing 50k in repairs before finally being evicted. Then if you can even serve them afterwards (and they don't make this easy) you can sue them, win, and if they have nothing you can take they get away with it.

That's bullshit. They need to go to a work camp until they produce 50k of value to repair their liability.


At the same time:
Is that a good incentive for corporations and governments to have? 
No it isn't. Just like it is a very bad thing to let the government deprive rights like guns and the vote because of "crimes". That gives them a motivation to use lawfare against personal and political enemies.

We don't ever want to be in a situation where they start charging a voter base with crimes and convicting them in partisan courts to take away their voting rights.

We can have the cake and eat it too by separating powers. The people who decide who gets paroled and prison time can't be the same people that stand to gain by it. They need to be personally rewarded for releasing convicts who don't re-offend and personally punished for releasing convicts who do re-offend.

Always the key to stable efficiency is personal motivation. Putting prisoners to work is fine so long as the people gaining from that work have zero say in whether they must keep working and would lose financially if the prisoner was not being put to efficient use.
Reece101
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@Shila
You encourage them to be upstanding citizens. 
Shila
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@Reece101
You encourage them to be upstanding citizens. 
By providing them healthcare and counseling.
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@Shila
You’re not even wrong.

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@Reece101
You’re not even wrong.
That is the same as saying I am right.
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@Sidewalker
I have to work to pay for my living expenses and health care, that is slavery too, it's unethical that I have to work for a living.
That's fair
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@Savant
Some would call it community service
A lot have no way to get commissary money and I think if you want cheap labor than it's fine to create a voluntary program. My issue would be if that was done in private prisons for non public work. 
Reece101
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@Shila
Yeah and also clouds exist. 
Shila
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@WyIted
Some would call it community service
A lot have no way to get commissary money and I think if you want cheap labor than it's fine to create a voluntary program. My issue would be if that was done in private prisons for non public work.
Private prisons are contracted by the government, and owned and operated entirely by third-party firms. 
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@Reece101
No. Prisoners shouldn't have to be anything but to work at being prisoners .
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@Mall
No. Prisoners shouldn't have to be anything but to work at being prisoners .
They all serve out their time in prison.
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@Reece101
Under the ideal system, prisons would be near-net-zero cost. Able bodied prisoners who could work but refused, assuming they had no money, would not only be denied food and water but their "cell" would be an outdoor space surrounded by walls. At most they'd have their basic needs provided for one or two months, long enough to collect a paycheck.

Prisons would contract out with companies to have factories adjacent to the prison grounds. People working there would make at least minimum wage, with a deduction equaling rent, utilities/amenities, and whatever it costs the prison to guard them, with those in lower security wings paying less and those in higher security wings paying more. Any prisoner willing to work 60-80 hours a week could make ends meet and perhaps save a little money. If your family outside prison (or some charity) was willing to pitch in, or if you had ample savings at the start of your imprisonment, then you might not have to work that much.

Prisoners would be allowed to seek work outside of prisons if they consented to have a tracker implanted under their skin. Then, in theory, they could hold down any job they wanted, assuming they were able to get transportation for it. Those who kept their heads down, diligently pursued career development, and climbed the ladder could end up living in roughly middle-class condos in the prison's low-security wing, and perhaps have their families stay with them if they were willing to do that. Low-security prisoners who had the money could buy any good that was vetted first and not deemed a security risk.

Prison jobs, or good jobs that prisoners found outside of prison, could include health plans among their benefits. In theory also, prisoners could apply for things like Medicare/Medicaid so long as these programs continued to exist, or any state programs like it. But if, in theory, their imprisonment left them unable to stay insured, I wouldn't lose any sleep over this, since choosing to commit a crime is effectively consent to take the risk that this might happen.
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@Swagnarok
Under the ideal system, prisons would be near-net-zero cost. Able bodied prisoners who could work but refused would not only be denied food and water but their "cell" would be an outdoor space surrounded by walls. At most they'd have their basic needs provided for one or two months, long enough to collect a paycheck.
Gulags in Soviet Russia were like that.

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@WyIted
Do you think that if prisoners were forced to work, that they would have less time to rape each other, or would rape still be as common?
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@Reece101
I think it would be good if prison were more self sustaining,
But I think it dangerous to make prisons 'profitable.
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@Best.Korea
We can stop rape in prisons easily. Just make it the death penalty. Put cameras up everywhere.
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@Savant
Let's just call it a debt owing.