Stopping the ageing clock will one day no doubt be a possibility.
It will then be necessary for a highly intelligent, ageless super-race to take control.
And the production of purposeless, resource consuming human dross must cease.
Ageless Superiority, will be the necessity of mankind.
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33
I should be eternal.
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@Best.Korea
Tru dat.
People must die, they would all turn into tyrannical genocidal assholes if they didn't.
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@sadolite
@zedvictor4
Dross?
Google says, "something regarded as worthless; rubbish."
Ah.
Take control of what?
Must they?
Why so?
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@sadolite
@Lemming
If there is no evolutionary purpose then nothing matters anyway.
But if there is a purpose, then I'm suggesting that we are reaching a stage where knowledge and technology are key and billions of worthless human organisms will be an unnecessary distraction.
An ageless super-race will/must prevail.
Natural selection.
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@Lemming
Immortality by definition requires population control which will lead to group think which will lead to the undesirable to be exterminated.
Group think = tyranny
population control = genocide
Assholes decide = who gets to live and who dies
As predictable as the sun coming up in the morning.
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@zedvictor4
The goal in Evolution is to wipe out stupid people.
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@sadolite
@zedvictor4
Where does this evolutionary purpose come from?
Was it placed?
Is it singular?
Or do you mean it more as long expected natural mechanisms?
Mechanisms that can accomplish this or that?
By this or that,
I mean that 'natural expected actions of X,
Can apply in various ways.
Niches in environments form, and various organisms find their place,
Remove a link and the ecosystem falls apart,
Yet there are different ecosystems, and organisms capable of filling different niches, depending on environment.
Not the direction I thought you might go,
But still interesting.
. . .
Suppose there is an island with two people and a cloning machine,
The island can support 4 people,
Why can't the island support 2 different lines of clones?
. . .
Arguably, even 'with people dying of old age,
Humans still form groups, compete, war at times.
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@FLRW
Gotta be right.
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@sadolite
I almost agree.
Though there are assholes, who will always consider superior beings to be assholes.
I say beings, because there are other intelligent evolutionary possibilities to consider.
A.I. and hybrid technology must be factored into the equation.
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@Lemming
Well.
Material evolution is ongoing and undeniable.
And all mechanisms and outcomes are naturally occurring, despite what we might think.
Ultimately the niche environment is out there somewhere in the vast universe, and I don't expect many Earth dependent organisms to be along for the ride.
And that includes most human organisms or hybrid entities too.
So I guess that most, if they still remain, will have to stay and fight it out until the end.
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@zedvictor4
We're in a niche now,
What's so special about the one out there somewhere in the vast universe?
I ask this, as your language implies to me some 'grand higher transcendent niche?
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@Lemming
Well.
Currently transcendent in terms of achievability
Though if we (in some form or another) are to be along for the entire evolutionary ride, then we have to accept that the future is out there somewhere.
This niche is unsustainable.
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@zedvictor4
I'm not sure what you see as so special about this theoretical future and location you speak.
What niche 'is sustainable?
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@zedvictor4
I'm gonna stick with my prediction, human kind isn't even Immortal and already heading down the path I spelled out. "Its for the greater good"
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@zedvictor4
"The Truth Is Out There -- Somewhere"
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@Lemming
4 people can be reasonable and smart to a common goal, 400 or 4000 or 4,000,000 people area collection of irrational, emotion driven idiots that will willfully doom their own existence just to think and feel they are right about everything regardless of how bad things get. "A person is smart, people are dumb"
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@sadolite
I 'do like the first MIB movie.
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@sadolite
I think that we are sort of in agreement, even though our hypotheticals are sketchy.
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@Lemming
The ongoing future will have ongoing specialism.
And for sure, this niche has been special, but it will eventually be unsustainable.
So we either seek out a new niche or Earth based intelligence will become extinct.
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@zedvictor4
It will then be necessary for a highly intelligent, ageless super-race to take control.
Ageless humans will never occur. Just as there exist finite set of cosmic physical laws and cosmic principles, there exist finite life span for biologics.
Yes there is the jelly fish { few kinds } that returns to a polyp phase of existence .." Turritopsis dohrnii, also known as the immortal jellyfish, is a species of small, biologically immortal jellyfish[2][3] found worldwide in temperate to tropic waters. It is one of the few known cases of animals capable of reverting completely to a sexually immature, colonial stage after having reached sexual maturity as a solitary individual.
..... it can revert to the polyp stage, forming a new polyp colony.[7] It does this through the cell development process of transdifferentiation, which alters the differentiated state of the cells and transforms them into new types of cells."...
Jelly fish are complex compared to a sponge { considered an animal } and evidence shows that the more complex jelly evolved at same time ---if not before--, the more simple sponge. Of course humans are much more complex than any jellies.
My prediction is based on one of only three, triangular, symmetrical/regular and convex polyhedra of Universe, the most complex of the three is the icosahedron. LNK
My prediction has long been that humans average will never surpass 120 years. The maximal number of symmetrical right-triangles that can appear on the maximal complex regular icosahedron is 120.
...." Icosahedral symmetry is not compatible with translational symmetry, so there are no associated crystallographic point groups or space groups. "... Here is visual and explanation of the 120 symmetrical right-triangles..." In geometry, a disdyakis triacontahedron, hexakis icosahedron, decakis dodecahedron or kisrhombic triacontahedron[1] is a Catalan solid with 120 faces and the dual to the Archimedean truncated icosidodecahedron. As such it is face-uniform but with irregular face polygons "...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disdyakis_triacontahedronIf we consider regular/symmetrical ---and more complex---non-convex polyhedra, then I dont know what that maximal number of right-triangle count would be and to be clear that involves internal structure of the polyhedra and not just the surface.
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@ebuc
Ageless humans will never occur.
And Man will never go to the Moon.
Understanding and manipulating, is a human specialism.
Never say never.
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@zedvictor4
And Man will never go to the Moon.
Your comparing most complex entities of Universe --barring black holes--- with going to the moon.
Was it Jules Vernes who envision shooting a projectile to the moon. Projecting projectiles has been around since first spears arrows sling shots appeared.
Understanding and manipulating, is a human specialism.
Yeah and I think you do not grasp the complexity involved here. It is one thing for a much more simple jelly to return to its poly form and to the regnerate with alternative type cells to create a new jelly.
Humans are not going back to fertilised egg phase or return to any human made womb.
Never say never.
Yeah, I saw that James Bond movie when it came out and it was fantasy land just like others. Lot money made in fantasy land entertainment. Movies are good temporary escape from issuse bothering us
120 years is my prediction for highest average that humans will ever reach. There is long finite list of finite possibilities with Universe an its parts. Humans have identified some of these and there called cosmic physical laws and cosmic principles ergo both are inviolate.
Finite speed-of-raditiation is approximatel 700 miles-per-hour.
Incomplete null geodesics aka singularties that General Realitity forumal lead to and proved by Roger Penrose in 1965 is one of those that appear to lead to the end of occupied space Universe. So obviously something is missing as naught can be created nor destroyed, only transformed.
To consider a little of this, go to 18:56 or so --further back a little more to understand the biologic aspect--- and watch til he mentions that, no one knows why early Universe would have such low entropy ---i.e. very uniform with any variation of uniformity temperature being no more than 0.001%
Go further to learn about entropy of black holes predicted by Jacob Bekenstien and later confirmed by S Hawking.Go to 21:25 and watch a litlle
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@ebuc
And Man will never go to the Moon.
I was just suggesting that results tend to exceed the expectations of naysayers.
Because we clearly possess the where with all to do so.
Therefore to suggest that we will never reverse or halt biological ageing mechanisms is somewhat contrary to everything we have achieved thus far.
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@zedvictor4
Therefore to suggest that we will never reverse or halt biological ageing mechanisms is somewhat contrary to everything we have achieved thus far.
There exist only finite's, based on all of human experience to date.
Yes it is true, that, better nutrition made for taller, stronger, and longevity for humans or any other animal yet there is no evidence for animals growing as large as as solar system
And yes it is true, that there is no known, finite average age limit for animals other than the cyclic jellies that return to polyp phase and regenerate differrent cells from the original jellie. Yet there is no evidence for extending human biologic life --or other animals--- eternally, except for circumstances with the above mentioned jellies
Naught is created nor destroyed, only transformed has only one known that contradicts its 1st law of thermodynamics, and that is incomplete null geodesics of photon in black holes that Roger Penrose proved the GR math correct in those respects.
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@ebuc
When it comes to physical structures, I wasn't suggesting that there was anything more than finite.
Though genetically engineering organic structures to stop the ageing process, is a likely future endeavour.
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@zedvictor4
Though genetically engineering organic structures to stop the ageing process, is a likely future endeavour.
Hi Zed. I still dont get how you arrive at eternally existent individual human fro your genetic engineering is likely comments.
Is there any biologic --even the simplest bacteria or twilight virus-- that has been engineer to exist eternally?
I understand you speculations lead you to making this belief comment. I speculate that all that exists is eternally in that all is coded in Gravitational field of some or collective set if black holes.
Some unrelated is this vid, that, addresses black holes in book by Lee Smolin time stamp 8:50
I understand you speculations lead you to making this belief comment. I speculate that all that exists is eternally in that all is coded in Gravitational field of some or collective set if black holes.
Some unrelated is this vid, that, addresses black holes in book by Lee Smolin time stamp 8:50
Time Stamps to consider in above vid about ' The Point of Universe
6:34 entropy ...least action...
7:00 to create complex humans so Universe can have eyes { mind/intellect } to know itself
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@ebuc
I never suggested "eternally existent".
I suggested genetically engineered agelessness.
And suggestions are not beliefs.
Just a discourse in respect of the future development of life, intelligence and evolutionary necessities.
Evolutionary necessity being one of two options.
The other option being pointless evolution.
Or,
I could also suggest that material development/evolution is perhaps no more than an elaborate process of decline, from one perfect state to another.