Instigator / Pro
0
1245
rating
395
debates
39.49%
won
Topic
#4775
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriages should be legally allowed
Status
Finished
The debate is finished. The distribution of the voting points and the winner are presented below.
Winner & statistics
Better arguments
0
0
Better sources
0
0
Better legibility
0
0
Better conduct
0
0
After not so many votes...
It's a tie!
Parameters
- Publication date
- Last updated date
- Type
- Rated
- Number of rounds
- 5
- Time for argument
- One week
- Max argument characters
- 30,000
- Voting period
- One month
- Point system
- Multiple criterions
- Voting system
- Open
- Minimal rating
- None
Contender / Con
0
1486
rating
10
debates
45.0%
won
Description
Definition
Child marriage - a marriage between an adult and a child or a marriage between a child and a child, and marriage where all participants are happy.
Round 1
Pro
#1
Topic
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriages should be legally allowed
Introduction
Child marriages are a sensitive topic for many people. However, there is a growing number of debates rising as to what is the right thing to do when one child has sex with the other child or with an adult, what is the right thing to do when child has sexual urges. In this debate, we will talk about problems that children face, and what can be done to solve them.
Definition
Child marriage - a marriage between an adult and a child or a marriage between a child and a child, and marriage where all participants are happy.
Arguments
1. Children have sexual urges.
Sexual urges dont start at age 18. In fact, they sometimes start as young as 7 or 8.
Some children masturbate as young as 4.
In USA, 30% of children had sex before age 16. 50% of children watched porn before age 13. Children have sexual urges.
2. Children have problems in controlling sexual urges
Children struggle to control their sexual urges. There is simply no way from preventing children from acting on their urges. Children have urges. Children need a safe outlet for their urges. Children have problems in controlling sexual urges.
3. Marriage is the best way to control urges
Having multiple sexual partners is harmful. However, children will act on their urges. Marrying to a person and committing to that person is the best for those children who have problems with urges.
If children dont marry, then they will have more sexual partners.
If children do marry, then they will have less sexual partners.
Marriage will allow them to have stable relationship before they reach adulthood.
It will help them avoid making risky choices later on in life due to loneliness or restlessness.
Marriage is the best way to control urges.
4. If there is no child marriage, there is harm
Legalization would help protect children from exploitation by ensuring they have legal protection under the law, and that relationships are regulated by the law. Without marriage, children will still have sexual urges and will still act on them. They will do so with much more partners. They will change lots of partners and increase risk of STI and STD. Having lots of partners throughout life increases depression and suicide rates. Marriage would make it so that child has only one partner and is committed to one partner, and not separated from the partner by others. If there is stigma, stigma causes harm to everyone in adult-child relationships. If child marriages are banned, then there is stigma on adult-child relationships. Legalizing child marriage would help to reduce the number of people who resort to sex work in order to earn money. People who resort to sex work are often those with failed relationships early in life. Child marriage helps protect relationships. If there is no child marriage, there is harm.
5. Banning child marriages increases prison population and torture in prisons
Torture is a very serious problem in prison. Prisons are, in most cases, forms of torture. Prisoners are often treated poorly, abused and violated. Decreasing prison population would improve lives. It would also improve economy, with less people in prison there is more available workforce for buisnesses. Banning child marriages increases prison population and torture in prisons.
6. Allowing child marriage increases child's happiness
Removing stigma would help children who are in sexual relationships. It would allow them to marry the person that makes them happy. Children in foster care would also have opportunity to marry and be saved from foster care. Child marriages save children from poverty. They make it possible for children from poor families to marry and live in a wealthier, better family. This helps those children, as well as their families who no longer have to provide for the child by themselves. Allowing child marriage increases child's happiness.
7. Society should listen to child's voice
Most of children who are in relationship with an adult dont want for that adult to go to prison. Sending that adult to prison would destroy child's happiness. It is better to let them marry. Society cannot decide what child does with own body. Child's body belongs to the child, not to society. Children have autonomy. By law of autonomy, you cannot use someone else's body without consent. Allowing young people to make decisions about own bodies without fear of judgement creates safe environment. In such environment, everyone feels that their decisions are respected no matter what kind of a relationship they are involved in. This promotes overall sense of autonomy among all population. Giving children ability to choose allows them to decide about their relationship which they are involved in, as opposed to adults making those decisions instead of them. Society should listen to child's voice.
8. Banning child marriages causes trauma for the child
If child has a parter, if child is in love with that partner and if that partner makes child happy, to separate them would cause trauma for the child. They should be allowed to love each other and give each other happiness. Banning child marriages causes trauma for the child.
9. Historical proof of valuing marriage and valuing child marriage working for the benefit of children tells us that child marriage isnt bad
In countries where child marriages are legal and where marriage is valued, there is much less STI, STD, and much less suicides.
In Afghanistan, child marriages are common. Marriage is encouraged and divorce is discouraged. Afghanistan has less suicides, less STI, and less STD than USA. Child marriage also increases care between people, as it strengthens ties between families. Historical proof of valuing marriage and valuing child marriage working for the benefit of children tells us that child marriage isnt bad.
10. Allowing child marriages increases birth rates
Woman will give birth to most children if she starts giving birth as early as possible. The longer she waits, the less children she can give birth to. Allowing child marriages makes it possible to raise more children. Allowing child marriages lowers the cost of raising children, as children no longer have to be provided by the parents until 18. Allowing child marriages increases birth rates.
11. Allowing child marriages helps adults, teenagers and children who are attracted to children
There is a significant amount of people who are sexually attracted to children. If society condemns child marriages, and calls those people monsters, then those people feel bad from their teenage years when they realize that they are attracted to children. Allowing child marriages would help them satisfy their urges in a way that is safer. About 15% of minor attracted persons are children and teenagers who feel pressure because of society's judgment. Allowing child marriages helps adults, teenagers and children who are attracted to children.
12. Allowing child marriages allows society to better regulate adult-child relationships
Most of adult-child relationships are never discovered. Both adults and children in such relationships have no one to guide them or to set rules of behavior. Adult has no guide on how to better treat a child. Child has no guide which could explain to a child how adult-child relationships are supposed to work. Allowing adult-child relationships changes that. Allowing adult-child relationships by allowing marriage would mean that both adult and a child would get more advice from others, and child would be better protected. Allowing child marriages allows society to better regulate adult-child relationships.
13. Great majority of adult-child relationships are not violent
In great majority of adult-child relationships, adult never used force or threat against a child, and never caused pain to a child. In great majority of cases, adult didnt have real sex with a child, but only did gentle sexual activities. Great majority of adult-child relationships are not violent.
14. Children can consent to be happy
Relationship with an adult in most cases causes happiness to a child. Children know what happiness is. Children can consent to be happy.
15. Child marriage increases relationship stability
Allowing children to marry gives them more control over their lives. If two young people have known each other since childhood and decide they want to get married before reaching adulthood, then this would give them more stability in their relationship than if they were not allowed to marry until 18. This would also lead to better financial security. Marriages provide more wealth than if person lived alone, while they cut down on expenses. Child marriage increases relationship stability.
16. Child marriage improves education for children
Child will have much better education if married, since then both the partner and parents can provide for the education. That is more resources than having parents alone. This especially helps single parents. Allowing child marriages also removes stigma from sexual education, allowing children to be better educated about their rights in a relationship. Child marriage improves education for children.
17. Child marriage protects pregnant teens and unborn children
Pregnant teens often have their reputation ruined by pregnancy. Sometimes the father of the child leaves the pregnant teen due to society's judgment. Sometimes a teen is forced to have an abortion due to stigma, and due to lack of marriage that is needed to have economical stability and support to raise a child. Allowing child marriages would prevent this. Being allowed to marry, and father being made responsible for his child would help pregnant teens and unborn children. Child marriage protects pregnant teens and unborn children.
18. Children are held accountable for their actions
We cannot say that children arent accountable for their actions. If a child commits a crime, child goes to prison. If child behaves bad, child gets punished. In the same way child is held accountable for bad behavior, the decisions that child makes are also to be considered important. We cannot say that child is only accountable when doing something bad, but not accountable when consenting to marriage. The decision of a child to enter marriage should be respected. Children are held accountable for their actions.
19. Child marriages are the tradition of our ancestors
By legalizing child marriage, we can preserve cultural heritages that have been passed down from generation-to-generation since ancient times.
Our ancestors married sometimes very young, at age 12 or 11. The age of consent 1000 years ago was usually 12, but it was not enforced and people married even younger.
Indigenous cultures around the world rely heavily upon early marriages between partners so that family lines remain intact. It also serves as strengthening of ties between clans through intermarriage agreements made prior birth. This becomes difficult without legal recognition. Allowing these practices legally ensures continuity within societies. It gives people freedom to express themselves culturally regardless of external pressures placed upon them by society.
20. Allowing child marriage gives child a choice
If child is treated badly by her own family, allowing child marriages would allow that child to leave family and marry for someone who will treat her better. Allowing child marriage gives child a choice.
Conclusion
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriages should be allowed. Children have sexual urges. Children have problems in controlling sexual urges. Marriage is the best way to control urges. If there is no child marriage, there is harm. Banning child marriages increases prison population and torture in prisons. Allowing child marriage increases child's happiness. Society should listen to child's voice. Banning child marriages causes trauma for the child. Historical proof of valuing marriage and valuing child marriage working for the benefit of children tells us that child marriage isnt bad. Allowing child marriages increases birth rates. Allowing child marriages helps adults, teenagers and children who are attracted to children. Allowing child marriages allows society to better regulate adult-child relationships. Great majority of adult-child relationships are not violent. Children can consent to be happy. Child marriage increases relationship stability. Child marriage improves education for children. Child marriage protects pregnant teens and unborn children. Children are held accountable for their actions. Child marriages are the tradition of our ancestors. Allowing child marriage gives child a choice.
Con
#2
Claim
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriage should not be legal
Arguments
1. Marriage is very different from having a partner. Partnership is essentially just two people living together, while marriage is a union in which the couple agrees to love and serve each other for their entire lives. In marriage they make a promise, and if they divorce, they break that promise. Young children are not old enough to fully comprehend the significance of such a decision, and even if teens do, they are not as likely to have good judgement and more likely to divorce.
2. Children should not act on their sexual urges. It's as simple as that. Actually, nobody should, but it is much harder to control the behavior of adults. Pro mentioned happiness in his argument, but does giving in to your urges really result in happiness? Of course it gives you momentary pleasure, but you will never find yourself truly free because you are a slave to your urges.
And although it is terrible for this to happen to adults, it is so much worse for children. Children, especially those under 12, are very easily molded, and if they don't learn self-discipline enough to control their urges, it will be much harder for them as adults.
Conclusion
Children cannot fully understand marriage, and so should not get married, but they should also control their urges and not give in. Giving in does not lead anywhere and it certainly does not lead to happiness (this is basically the moral of every Disney princess movie).
I challenge everyone reading this to give something up for 40 days, like a food or tv show or social media, and see if you are happier then than you are now. Happiness does not come from freedom of choice, but from freedom of the mind.
Round 2
Pro
#3
Rebuttals
1. Marriage is very different from having a partner. Partnership is essentially just two people living together, while marriage is a union in which the couple agrees to love and serve each other for their entire lives.
An important difference. Marriage encourages staying with one partner. Staying with one partner is better for mental health.
In marriage they make a promise, and if they divorce, they break that promise.
Less likely to separate if married.
Young children are not old enough to fully comprehend the significance of such a decision, and even if teens do, they are not as likely to have good judgement and more likely to divorce.
Children who are not allowed to marry are more likely to have multiple sexual partners, more likely to separate from their partner.
2. Children should not act on their sexual urges.
This is not an argument. Children will act on their sexual urges, and there is no way to prevent that.
Pro mentioned happiness in his argument, but does giving in to your urges really result in happiness?
The argument was that children are happy in relationships with adults, not specifically for giving in to urges. There is also attachment involved.
Of course it gives you momentary pleasure, but you will never find yourself truly free because you are a slave to your urges.
By this logic, you should own nothing.
And although it is terrible for this to happen to adults, it is so much worse for children. Children, especially those under 12, are very easily molded, and if they don't learn self-discipline enough to control their urges, it will be much harder for them as adults.
Actually, the countries that taught abstinence, such as USA, are some of the most sexually immoral countries on Earth. You cannot teach children to control their urges.
Children cannot fully understand marriage, and so should not get married
That argument makes no sense, since such argument applies to everything. Example: Children shouldnt be vaccinated. Children cannot fully understand vaccinations. Children should not be born. Children cannot understand life.
, but they should also control their urges and not give in
Method that never worked anywhere.
Giving in does not lead anywhere and it certainly does not lead to happiness (this is basically the moral of every Disney princess movie).
Cant prevent giving in.
I challenge everyone reading this to give something up for 40 days, like a food or tv show or social media, and see if you are happier then than you are now. Happiness does not come from freedom of choice, but from freedom of the mind
Children cannot be taught to give up sexual urges. It is better for them to marry. They can be satisfied safely in marriage or unsafely outside of marriage.
Con
#4
Rebuttals
1. Sexual urges dont start at age 18. In fact, they sometimes start as young as 7 or 8.Some children masturbate as young as 4.
4 is below the age of reason, so what they are doing is purely innocent and not at all sexual, and children of 7 or 8 would only have urges that young if they were taught that it is okay to have them.
In USA, 30% of children had sex before age 16. 50% of children watched porn before age 13. Children have sexual urges.
Yes, but if they were raised believing that sex before marriage is bad, they wouldn't.
2. Children struggle to control their sexual urges. There is simply no way from preventing children from acting on their urges. Children have urges. Children need a safe outlet for their urges. Children have problems in controlling sexual urges.
As I said in my earlier argument, children are very easily molded. If they have always been taught that having urges is okay, it will be hard for them to control them. But even if they haven't been taught self-discipline, it is never impossible for them to control their urges.
3. Having multiple sexual partners is harmful. However, children will act on their urges. Marrying to a person and committing to that person is the best for those children who have problems with urges.If children dont marry, then they will have more sexual partners.If children do marry, then they will have less sexual partners.Marriage will allow them to have stable relationship before they reach adulthood.It will help them avoid making risky choices later on in life due to loneliness or restlessness.Marriage is the best way to control urges.
People who get married are less likely to have multiple sexual partners. But anyone who marries purely for sexual reasons is not likely to stay together, and it is worse for someone to get married and divorce than for someone to have multiple partners.
4. Legalization would help protect children from exploitation by ensuring they have legal protection under the law, and that relationships are regulated by the law. Without marriage, children will still have sexual urges and will still act on them. They will do so with much more partners. They will change lots of partners and increase risk of STI and STD. Having lots of partners throughout life increases depression and suicide rates. Marriage would make it so that child has only one partner and is committed to one partner, and not separated from the partner by others. If there is stigma, stigma causes harm to everyone in adult-child relationships. If child marriages are banned, then there is stigma on adult-child relationships. Legalizing child marriage would help to reduce the number of people who resort to sex work in order to earn money. People who resort to sex work are often those with failed relationships early in life. Child marriage helps protect relationships. If there is no child marriage, there is harm.
Between 70 and 80 percent of child marriages end in divorce. That is twice as much as the average divorce rate in the US. Girls under 18 who marry are also twice as likely to drop out of school, twice as likely to live in poverty, and three times likely to get beaten by their husband. (Forbes.com) Child marriage does not reduce depression.
5. Torture is a very serious problem in prison. Prisons are, in most cases, forms of torture. Prisoners are often treated poorly, abused and violated. Decreasing prison population would improve lives. It would also improve economy, with less people in prison there is more available workforce for buisnesses. Banning child marriages increases prison population and torture in prisons
If torture is a problem in prisons, then we should reform the them. Legalizing child marriages would decrease prison population, but all that means is that there are less people in the prisons, and more people with the freedom to do what they want with children. Obviously not all child marriages would be forced, but it would be so much easier for people to take advantage of children, especially if they were already living in abusive situations.
6. Removing stigma would help children who are in sexual relationships. It would allow them to marry the person that makes them happy. Children in foster care would also have opportunity to marry and be saved from foster care. Child marriages save children from poverty. They make it possible for children from poor families to marry and live in a wealthier, better family. This helps those children, as well as their families who no longer have to provide for the child by themselves. Allowing child marriage increases child's happiness.
They could be happier and wealthier, but they could also easily be poorer and in abusive relationships.
7. Most of children who are in relationship with an adult dont want for that adult to go to prison. Sending that adult to prison would destroy child's happiness. It is better to let them marry. Society cannot decide what child does with own body. Child's body belongs to the child, not to society. Children have autonomy. By law of autonomy, you cannot use someone else's body without consent. Allowing young people to make decisions about own bodies without fear of judgement creates safe environment. In such environment, everyone feels that their decisions are respected no matter what kind of a relationship they are involved in. This promotes overall sense of autonomy among all population. Giving children ability to choose allows them to decide about their relationship which they are involved in, as opposed to adults making those decisions instead of them. Society should listen to child's voice.
But children are not mature enough to make a decision that will affect them for life, and so more likely to get a divorce and be less happy than before.
8. If child has a parter, if child is in love with that partner and if that partner makes child happy, to separate them would cause trauma for the child. They should be allowed to love each other and give each other happiness. Banning child marriages causes trauma for the child.
Same answer as #7, but also true and lasting happiness cannot be sensual. It does not last.
9. In countries where child marriages are legal and where marriage is valued, there is much less STI, STD, and much less suicides.In Afghanistan, child marriages are common. Marriage is encouraged and divorce is discouraged. Afghanistan has less suicides, less STI, and less STD than USA. Child marriage also increases care between people, as it strengthens ties between families. Historical proof of valuing marriage and valuing child marriage working for the benefit of children tells us that child marriage isnt bad.
Very true. The reason of this, however, is because child marriages in the past and in most other countries have nothing to do with sexual urges. I think 100 years ago I would have agreed with child marriage at a certain age but teenagers now are not as mature as they were then. And in other countries, such as Afghanistan, it is the cultural norm to get married young. The marriages are usually arranged by parents to ensure their child's financial and social well being. In Afghanistan, between 60 and 80 percent of all marriages are arranged. (UN Women)
10. Woman will give birth to most children if she starts giving birth as early as possible. The longer she waits, the less children she can give birth to. Allowing child marriages makes it possible to raise more children. Allowing child marriages lowers the cost of raising children, as children no longer have to be provided by the parents until 18. Allowing child marriages increases birth rates.
It also increases death rates. Girls between 15 and 19 are twice as likely to die during child birth than those over 20, and girls under 15 are five times more likely. (Advocates for Youth)
11. There is a significant amount of people who are sexually attracted to children. If society condemns child marriages, and calls those people monsters, then those people feel bad from their teenage years when they realize that they are attracted to children. Allowing child marriages would help them satisfy their urges in a way that is safer. About 15% of minor attracted persons are children and teenagers who feel pressure because of society's judgment. Allowing child marriages helps adults, teenagers and children who are attracted to children.
Society is against child marriages because it supposes them to be abusive relationships, and while they might not be, they could be.
12. Most of adult-child relationships are never discovered. Both adults and children in such relationships have no one to guide them or to set rules of behavior. Adult has no guide on how to better treat a child. Child has no guide which could explain to a child how adult-child relationships are supposed to work. Allowing adult-child relationships changes that. Allowing adult-child relationships by allowing marriage would mean that both adult and a child would get more advice from others, and child would be better protected. Allowing child marriages allows society to better regulate adult-child relationships.
Again, this would help if the relationship was good, but not if it was abusive.
13. In great majority of adult-child relationships, adult never used force or threat against a child, and never caused pain to a child. In great majority of cases, adult didnt have real sex with a child, but only did gentle sexual activities. Great majority of adult-child relationships are not violent.
There is no evidence here for this.
14. Relationship with an adult in most cases causes happiness to a child. Children know what happiness is. Children can consent to be happy.
They can always consent to be happy
15. Allowing children to marry gives them more control over their lives. If two young people have known each other since childhood and decide they want to get married before reaching adulthood, then this would give them more stability in their relationship than if they were not allowed to marry until 18. This would also lead to better financial security. Marriages provide more wealth than if person lived alone, while they cut down on expenses. Child marriage increases relationship stability.
If they get married before 18 they might not have reached full maturity, and might later decide that they are not good for each other. And they would probably not be as financially wise either.
16. Child will have much better education if married, since then both the partner and parents can provide for the education. That is more resources than having parents alone. This especially helps single parents. Allowing child marriages also removes stigma from sexual education, allowing children to be better educated about their rights in a relationship. Child marriage improves education for children.
As said in #4, children who marry are twice as likely to drop out of school.
17. Pregnant teens often have their reputation ruined by pregnancy. Sometimes the father of the child leaves the pregnant teen due to society's judgment. Sometimes a teen is forced to have an abortion due to stigma, and due to lack of marriage that is needed to have economical stability and support to raise a child. Allowing child marriages would prevent this. Being allowed to marry, and father being made responsible for his child would help pregnant teens and unborn children. Child marriage protects pregnant teens and unborn children.
See #10.
18. We cannot say that children arent accountable for their actions. If a child commits a crime, child goes to prison. If child behaves bad, child gets punished. In the same way child is held accountable for bad behavior, the decisions that child makes are also to be considered important. We cannot say that child is only accountable when doing something bad, but not accountable when consenting to marriage. The decision of a child to enter marriage should be respected. Children are held accountable for their actions.
Again, between 70 and 80 percent of child marriages end in divorce, so it is shown that children do not understand marriage enough to get married.
19. By legalizing child marriage, we can preserve cultural heritages that have been passed down from generation-to-generation since ancient times.Our ancestors married sometimes very young, at age 12 or 11. The age of consent 1000 years ago was usually 12, but it was not enforced and people married even younger.Indigenous cultures around the world rely heavily upon early marriages between partners so that family lines remain intact. It also serves as strengthening of ties between clans through intermarriage agreements made prior birth. This becomes difficult without legal recognition. Allowing these practices legally ensures continuity within societies. It gives people freedom to express themselves culturally regardless of external pressures placed upon them by society.
In the past, child marriages had nothing to do with sex. And back then, you were considered an adult when you reached puberty, which is around 12 for girls.
20. If child is treated badly by her own family, allowing child marriages would allow that child to leave family and marry for someone who will treat her better. Allowing child marriage gives child a choice.
Children are shown to consistently make bad decisions.
Rebuttals 2.0
In marriage they make a promise, and if they divorce, they break that promise.Less likely to separate if married.
But better have multiple partners than divorce
Pro mentioned happiness in his argument, but does giving in to your urges really result in happiness?The argument was that children are happy in relationships with adults, not specifically for giving in to urges. There is also attachment involved.
Would they still be happy then if they were not able to have sex?
Of course it gives you momentary pleasure, but you will never find yourself truly free because you are a slave to your urges.By this logic, you should own nothing.
No, just nothing you are a slave to.
And although it is terrible for this to happen to adults, it is so much worse for children. Children, especially those under 12, are very easily molded, and if they don't learn self-discipline enough to control their urges, it will be much harder for them as adults.Actually, the countries that taught abstinence, such as USA, are some of the most sexually immoral countries on Earth. You cannot teach children to control their urges.
America is just about the worst country in dealing with abstinence. Everything is immediate and there is practically no delayed gratification. Afghanistan would actually be a better example, as they celebrate Ramadan.
Children cannot fully understand marriage, and so should not get marriedThat argument makes no sense, since such argument applies to everything. Example: Children shouldnt be vaccinated. Children cannot fully understand vaccinations. Children should not be born. Children cannot understand life.
These examples are not the same. Children do not need to understand vaccinations or being born because their parents do, and they trust them. But in getting married, the child is completely on their own, and even if they have their parents do advise them, they still ultimately make their own decisions.
, but they should also control their urges and not give inMethod that never worked anywhere.
Google "stories of people who gave up sexual pleasures". There are hundreds of them.
Conclusion
Child marriages should not be legal for the above reasons.
Round 3
Pro
#5
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriages should be legally allowed
Arguments
21. Banning child marriages harms innocent people who are in prison
There is no doubt that there are innocent people in prison. Some people didnt commit the crime, but the witnesses lied about them and put them in prison. If someone is put in prison for having a relationship with a child, but is in fact innocent and didnt do that, he would still be beaten and abused in prison. Banning child marriages harms innocent people who are in prison.
22. Sexual activities in marriage are healthy for children
There are plenty of benefits of sexual activities and orgasms. The benefits include living longer, being less likely to get ill, having better mood and improved reasoning. There is no reason to believe that only adults receieve benefits from sexual activities. Children receieve same benefits. Sexual activities make children happy when they are desired by children themselves. There are plenty of examples of children engaging in sexual activities with other children. Sexual activities are safest in marriage. Sexual activities in marriage are healthy for children.
23. It is wrong to say that if children dont fully understand something, that it should not be done
It is wrong to say: "Children shouldnt be vaccinated. Children cannot fully understand vaccinations. Children should not be born. Children cannot fully understand life.".
If children dont fully understand child marriages, that does not mean that child marriages are wrong. Children can desire to be married. Children have partial understanding of child marriages. Partial understanding is enough to have a desire. Most adults dont have complete understanding of each other, as they cant read each others thoughts. Allowing child marriages is beneficial for children. Child marriages make children happy and provide health benefits. It is wrong to say that if children dont fully understand something, that it should not be done.
24. Judgment harms children
Society's judgment harms children who are in relationship with adults, teenagers or other children. They would not be able to figure out why society hates their relationship. This would make them feel shame, and be uncomfortable to even mention their relationship due to fear of upsetting others. The judgment would make them feel like they are approving of something bad and participating in something bad. The judgment would make them blame themselves. It would make them more scared, confused, depressed and suicidal. Judgment harms children.
25. Judgment causes general harm
People often justify their evil actions by saying that they are still better than others. For example, a person might justify polluting the environment by thinking that it is not bad because he is still better than map which he judges. Judgment causes harm by harming children who are futute scientists. It harms innovation. Judgment causes general harm.
26. Child marriages help prevent violence over children
Banning child marriages wont make violence go away. Banning child marriages will make violence harder to detect. Allowing child marriages makes the relationship known. If the relationship is known, it is easier to regulate it and prevent violence. Child marriages help prevent violence over children.
27. Child marriages give the child more autonomy
Child's body belongs to the child. It does not belong to anyone else. Therefore, only child can make decisions regarding own body. Child marriages allow a child to make a choice, and make it so that the child is better informed. Child marriages allow a child to marry for who child wants, who child likes, who is kind to child and who makes child happy. Children are not a property, and banning children from marrying who they want would decrease child's autonomy. Banning children from making important decisions decreases their knowledge about important things, and harms them once they are adults. Child marriages give the child more autonomy.
Rebuttals
4 is below the age of reason, so what they are doing is purely innocent and not at all sexual, and children of 7 or 8 would only have urges that young if they were taught that it is okay to have them.
I dont see how is this an argument. My opponent assumes that at age 4, there is no sexual activities. However, children at age 4 can reach orgasm and can experience sexual pleasure. It is even more often for children at 7, and even more often for children at age 12.
My opponent seems to provide reason why children have sexual urges, apparently, that they were taught. However, we see that it is not possible to prevent children from knowing, with all the movies containing sex, and with child's curiosity to discover themselves, and with regular community talk which informs children, and with people who seek to inform children to build a relationship with them.
Yes, but if they were raised believing that sex before marriage is bad, they wouldn't.
Not an argument. People have urges. You cant teach someone not to have an urge.
As I said in my earlier argument, children are very easily molded. If they have always been taught that having urges is okay, it will be hard for them to control them. But even if they haven't been taught self-discipline, it is never impossible for them to control their urges
It is impossible, as entire history shows that controlling sexual urges is impossible to implement. It is also harmful and causes mental pain and discomfort, along with losing health benefits of sex, along with those who cant control their urges be judged by everyone and therefore, harmed.
People who get married are less likely to have multiple sexual partners. But anyone who marries purely for sexual reasons is not likely to stay together, and it is worse for someone to get married and divorce than for someone to have multiple partners.
Actually, the more partners the person has, the more suicidal and depressed that person becomes. However, countries that value marriage and child marriage have very low divorce rate.
Between 70 and 80 percent of child marriages end in divorce. That is twice as much as the average divorce rate in the US. Girls under 18 who marry are also twice as likely to drop out of school, twice as likely to live in poverty, and three times likely to get beaten by their husband. (Forbes.com) Child marriage does not reduce depression.
Being married and then divorcing is better than having sex outside of marriage. Sex outside of marriage is bad for mental health.
Valuing marriage and valuing child marriage is the correct path.
I have already pointed the example of Afghanistan, where there is less divorce, less suicides and higher birth rates than in USA.
Your data is just a misrepresentation. Your data mistakes correlation for causation. Poor children are more likely to get married. Its not the child marriage that causes poverty. It is the poverty which increases the likelyhood of child marriage.
Violence and dropping out of school is common in poor communities, just as child marriages are common in poor communities.
Banning child marriage will not make violence go away, as violent people dont stop being violent if they are not married to a person they commit violence against.
Child marriages make the relationship known and easier to regulate.
In USA, there is plenty of violence over children, plenty of depression, plenty of suicides. Child marriages are banned in USA.
If torture is a problem in prisons, then we should reform the them. Legalizing child marriages would decrease prison population, but all that means is that there are less people in the prisons, and more people with the freedom to do what they want with children. Obviously not all child marriages would be forced, but it would be so much easier for people to take advantage of children, especially if they were already living in abusive situations.
Most of adult-child relationships are never discovered. If child marriages were legal, it would be possible to regulate those relationships, and make them better for children and secure that children are happy in them.
This topic does not deal with abusers. Abusers should still be punished.
However, if an adult is kind and friendly to the child and doesnt force a child to anything, and if child is happy and wants to be with that adult, judging such a relationship would be harmful for that child and for that adult.
Punishing such an adult by torturing him in prison is wrong. Prisons are always torture, as lack of desired options is always a torture.
But children are not mature enough to make a decision that will affect them for life, and so more likely to get a divorce and be less happy than before.
Child marriages make children happy and serve for their benefit. Banning child marriages wont make relationships with children go away. Banning child marriages will just cause more broken relationships and more sex outside of marriage.
Very true. The reason of this, however, is because child marriages in the past and in most other countries have nothing to do with sexual urges. I think 100 years ago I would have agreed with child marriage at a certain age but teenagers now are not as mature as they were then. And in other countries, such as Afghanistan, it is the cultural norm to get married young. The marriages are usually arranged by parents to ensure their child's financial and social well being. In Afghanistan, between 60 and 80 percent of all marriages are arranged.
If arranged child marriages have all those benefits, then it logically follows that valuing marriages and child marriages is good. Of course, I argue for child marriages that are not arranged by adults only, but also where child desires to be in that marriage. Such marriages would provide even more benefits for children.
It also increases death rates. Girls between 15 and 19 are twice as likely to die during child birth than those over 20, and girls under 15 are five times more likely.
Yes. However, birth creates more life. If you have 1000 women each giving birth to 1 child, and only 1 woman dying during child birth, the total life increased by 999.
However, child marriages can double the birth rates.
Being five times more likely to die and having double birth rates means in this same example that 5 girls die, but 2000 children are born. So the life is increased by 1995 lives. Thats almost double than in first example.
Also, there is a common misunderstanding that banning child marriages prevents early pregnancy. It does not.
Allowing child marriages allows society to better educate children, and lower or increase birth rates if necessary.
Without child marriages, children still get pregnant. However, it is more difficult to regulate and educate children about safe sex if child marriages are banned. It is also more difficult for pregnant teens to maintain their relationship if they are judged and not allowed to marry.
There is no evidence here for this.
The book called "The Trauma Myth" deals with statistics about adult child relationships. It says that most of those relationships arent violent, and child is usually happy in those relationships. After all, if adult is kind and friendly to the child, and doesnt force the child to anything, child will like that adult.
Children are shown to consistently make bad decisions.
This is not an argument to prevent children from making decisions. Person learns from mistakes too. Preventing children from learning would be bad for them. It was shown that child marriage benefits children by reducing depression and suicides, by reducing sex outside of marriage, by making children happier and healthier, by protecting children in relationships, by removing stigma which hurts children. It also helps better guide adults on how to treat children, as opposed to increasing prison population and torture. It was also pointed out that most relationships are never discovered and great majority of children dont want for their partner to go to prison. They keep same opinion even when they grow up. Their opinion should be respected.
Would they still be happy then if they were not able to have sex?
You cannot prevent them from having sex.
America is just about the worst country in dealing with abstinence. Everything is immediate and there is practically no delayed gratification. Afghanistan would actually be a better example, as they celebrate Ramadan.
Afghanistan only practices abstinence outside of marriage. No country was able to stop children from acting on their urges, or adults from being with children.
These examples are not the same. Children do not need to understand vaccinations or being born because their parents do, and they trust them. But in getting married, the child is completely on their own, and even if they have their parents do advise them, they still ultimately make their own decisions.
By same logic, children do not need to fully understand child marriages. Society can understand child marriages, and decide that children should be allowed to marry because of the benefits it gives. Children in child marriages are not on their own, as society and parents are there to advise them and protect them if something goes wrong in marriage.
Banning child marriages leaves children on their own, as there is no one to guide them as the relationships are secret when child marriages are banned.
Child marriage is a child's choice. When child grows into adult, she doesnt want for her partner to go to prison. Since adults are well informed, it follows that child marriage is well informed decision of a child who approves of her child marriage even after becoming adult.
This is what is known as "future consent". When child grows up, she agrees that her marriage as a child wasnt a bad thing.
Google "stories of people who gave up sexual pleasures". There are hundreds of them.
Not all people are built the same. Some people dont even have sexual urges. Some have weak sexual urges. Some have very strong sexual urges. No country managed to stop children from having sex. Plus, supressing urges is unhealthy.
Con
#6
Arguments
3. Child marriage destroys childhood. Not only would children be less likely to go to school, but they would also have to worry about their spouse, and if they were older, take care of their children. They would have much less time to play or hang out with friends. They might even feel pressured to get a job younger if they were in need of money, because it is very hard to run a family with only one breadwinner.
Rebuttals
21. There is no doubt that there are innocent people in prison. Some people didnt commit the crime, but the witnesses lied about them and put them in prison. If someone is put in prison for having a relationship with a child, but is in fact innocent and didnt do that, he would still be beaten and abused in prison. Banning child marriages harms innocent people who are in prison.
This is more a question of reforming the judicial system. There will always be innocent people who are put in prison and legalizing child marriage will not necessarily increase that number, and the innocent people put in prison would certainly not outweigh the guilty ones.
Also, if prison is torture, how do you think we should treat criminals? If we only fined them they would just go back to what they were doing before.
22. There are plenty of benefits of sexual activities and orgasms. The benefits include living longer, being less likely to get ill, having better mood and improved reasoning. There is no reason to believe that only adults receieve benefits from sexual activities. Children receieve same benefits. Sexual activities make children happy when they are desired by children themselves. There are plenty of examples of children engaging in sexual activities with other children. Sexual activities are safest in marriage. Sexual activities in marriage are healthy for children.
Sex can be healthy, but only if it is done in moderation, around once a week, and it's not healthy if you think about it too much and become obsessed with it. (healthyshots) Sex is meant to strengthen and nourish relationships and should not be done just for the pleasure of it.
There are many negative effects that occur when children do it. A 2017 study found that early sex is linked to a two to three times greater likelihood of experiencing depression in the past week. Girls who have sex before 16 are also more likely to get divorced, and boys are more likely to experience cannabis abuse. (PsychCentral)
I am not going to respond to all the arguments given by pro because I have already addressed most of them and some are similar to each other. I think one of the main points we disagree on is the meaning and importance of happiness. Most of pro's arguments are centralized around happiness; children should have an outlet for their urges because it makes them happy. Based on his arguments, pro believes that sensual happiness is more important than absolute happiness. (For clarity between these two terms, here is an article - https://www.theworldcounts.com/purpose/types-of-happiness-in-psychology) How can something momentary be more important than something that lasts forever?
"You sound like you have a personal problem with the virtue of chastity, and in fact all virtue, because, it appears, you were never taught to use your free will and therefore cannot imagine how anyone else could. I propose you examine yourself on your own intellectual honesty, and read, perhaps, some solidly human philosophy such as that of Aristotle, for you think so little of man's rationality and hold in such high esteem all man's basest instincts that it remains to be seen whether you would not rather be turned Beast like the prince in the old story." - Clara Schumann
Round 4
Pro
#7
28. It is not possible to prevent children from having sex
We see that it is not possible to prevent children from knowing about sex, with all the movies containing sex, and with child's curiosity to discover themselves, and with regular community talk which informs children, and with people who seek to inform children to build a relationship with them. You cant teach children not to have an urge. Entire history shows that controlling sexual urges is impossible to implement. It is also harmful and causes mental pain and discomfort, along with losing health benefits of sex, along with those who cant control their urges be judged by everyone and therefore, harmed. No country was able to stop children from acting on their urges, or adults from being with children.
29. Future consent tells us what is right
Preventing children from learning would be bad for them. Banning child marriages prevents children from learning. They will be less informed if they are not allowed to be in relationships. It was shown that child marriage benefits children by reducing depression and suicides, by reducing sex outside of marriage, by making children happier and healthier, by protecting children in relationships, by removing stigma which hurts children. It also helps better guide adults on how to treat children, as opposed to increasing prison population and torture. It was also pointed out that most relationships are never discovered and great majority of children dont want for their partner to go to prison. They keep same opinion even when they grow up. Their opinion should be respected.
Children do not need to fully understand child marriages. Society can understand child marriages, and decide that children should be allowed to marry because of the benefits it gives. Children in child marriages are not on their own, as society and parents are there to advise them and protect them if something goes wrong in marriage.
Banning child marriages leaves children on their own, as there is no one to guide them as the relationships are secret when child marriages are banned.
Child marriage is a child's choice. When child grows into adult, she doesnt want for her partner to go to prison. Since adults are well informed, it follows that child marriage is well informed decision of a person who approves of her child marriage after becoming adult.
This is what is known as "future consent". When child grows up, she agrees that her marriage as a child wasnt a bad thing.
30. Power doesnt matter in a loving relationship
Most of child abuse is caused by children. A 14 year old can easily abuse a 10 year old if in relationship with her. A 14 year old can easily abuse another 14 year old if he is much stronger than her. Even among adults, man can easily abuse a woman due to being stronger.
Children are more likely to get abused by other children than by adults. Adults have more control over their actions. They can be better educated by society. They also have more moral maturity.
In every relationship, one person is more "powerful". In parenting, parents are more powerful than children. However, in loving and consensual relationships, power doesnt matter as there is no force at play. Adult and child have attachment to each other. They love each other and make each other happy. They do that which both have the desire for. Child marriage helps create stronger attachment and increases happiness.
31. Child marriages prevent children from being in bad company
Most of the children who enter into bad company do so because they dont have guidance and because they desire sex.
Child marriage satisfies child's sexual urges and gives guidance to children.
32. Child marriages ensure that children have same rights as adults
Children have the right to love and to form relationships. It would be cruel to deny children of that until adulthood, as certain percentage of children never reach adulthood. Child marriages are in child's interest. Future consent demonstrates that. Child desires love and creates attachments. To destroy child's love and child's attachment would be very cruel and inhumane, and would reduce children to mere property without a voice.
33. Banning child marriages increases the number of child sexual abuse
You cannot reduce sex with children by criminalizing it. The victims, as explained before, dont want to speak out. They like the adult and dont want him harmed.
The number of abuse cases keeps growing. Map always assume they wont be caught. Due to lack of marriage and lack of legality, some map resort to having sexual activities with lots of children. There were even cases of one map being with over 100 children. Without the ability to marry and without legal protection, map person has less reasons to stay with just one child. There is no education to guide map in behavior. There is no legal law that he must follow. The longer map stays with one child, the more likely map is to get caught. Due to having to hide the relationship, map is more likely to end a relationship and seek other children when map suspects that the current relationship will be discovered if he continues. When child marriages are banned, map would impose himself more on a child, due to no education and no legal guide for behavior. Map is also more likely to use threats against a child, in an attempt to hide the relationship. Map is also more likely to hurt a child when child marriages are banned. This is due to less reasons to treat child well. If he is nice, he might go to prison. If he is not nice, he might go to prison. No matter what he does, he might go to prison. If child marriages were legal and regulated, map would be able to satisfy his urges legally and at the same time follow the rules not to hurt a child. He would be punished if he hurts a child, but tolerated if he doesnt. This gives him a reason not to hurt a child, as he would be much safer and in much better position if he doesnt. Most map are kind non-violent people. However, there are those who are violent. Banning child marriages makes them much more violent and harder to control.
The proof for child marriages reducing sexual abuse is Afghanistan and USA. In USA, 30% of children have sex before age 16. In Afghanistan, only 4% of children are married before age 15. In USA, child marriages are banned and condemned. In Afghanistan, they are seen as normal. We see that allowing child marriages does not harm children, not in terms of scale and not in terms of abuse, as Afghanistan has less suicides, less divorce and less STD than USA. STD is confirmed even by random testing, and all sources agree that STD is lower in Afghanistan. Let us be reminded that Afghanistan is a poor country, and that USA is among world's most developed nations. The fact that Afghanistan has child marriages and outmatches US proves that there is value in child marriage.
34. Banning child marriages increases the number of forced abortions
If child is in a relationship with an adult, and if child gets pregnant and relationship is discovered, child will be convinced to have an abortion. Even if child doesnt want to abort, the pressure of adults will break her. The decision to have an abortion will be, by all standards, an adult's decision imposed on a child.
35. If child marriages are banned, child is treated differently
When the police gets involved, child is scared and confused. The police will persuade a child that what happened to her was wrong. Parents will continue the persuasion. Child will even visit psychologists who will add to persuasion. In short, entire society will try to convince her that the adult who was so kind to her was in fact a monster. This confuses the child who cannot find a reasonable explanation for adult's reaction, and is forced to accept adult's explanation that was imposed on her so many times. She simply isnt allowed to disagree, or she will be faced with more convincing, more emotional attacks and more visits to psychologists. Adults, who are in greater number and better at reasoning than she is, will simply outmatch her. That is the true power imbalance.
36. This society doesnt care about child's well being
Plenty of people spank children, even tho it was proven that spanking harms children. Plenty of people give children junk food, knowing it is bad for child's health, teeth and brain, and that it causes obesity. Plenty of people lie to children and therefore, teach children to use lies. Plenty of people break the speed limit, knowing that it increases the chances of children being hurt and dying in traffic. They dont care. Plenty of people support circumcision, knowing that it harms children. Plenty of people dont bother to try to fix foster care system, knowing that plenty of child abuse happens in foster care. Children abuse children there. Plenty of people smoke, knowing it increases the chances of birth defects and makes children more likely to smoke. People upload porn to internet making it easily available, knowing that children might see it. Its not the map who needs to change. This society is wrong about child marriages. This society is blind. Its this corrupt society which harms children while claiming that map harm children. These are double standards that society should abandon. You cannot judge others for that which you yourself do.
37. Being married to adult carries benefits for the child
Child being married to adult will learn a lot from that adult, much more than she would have learned from having other child as partner. Adults are much more morally advanced than children and have greater knowledge. Child cannot teach a child as much as adult can teach a child. Adult is also more likely to behave well and maintain a stable marriage, where relationships between child and child are much more likely to break.
38. Banning child marriages leads to age discrimination
Adult child relationships are the crime in which crime is only a crime due to age of an adult. For example, two 12 year olds being in sexual relationship is condemned, but not a crime. But a sexual relationship between 12 year old and 18 year old is a crime. Therefore, person is assumed to have caused harm only because of his age, not because of the activity he does.
39. Banning child marriages harms child-child sexual relationships
Our society condemns children for having sex with other children and for masturbating. Parents still condemn if their 9 year old had sex with a 12 year old. Parents still shame 4 year olds if they catch them masturbate. This causes children to feel shame and guilt, which increases depression. If child marriages were allowed, relationships between child and child would also be better tolerated and children would be less depressed and less shamed for having sexual activities or masturbating. This would help them grow into free persons without judgment or fear.
40. Child marriages support LGBT rights
Trans children are being judged by our society, simply because our society believes that children shouldnt have a choice. The idea of individual's autonomy would be supported by legalization of child marriages. Child marriages support the idea of giving child a choice, which supports trans rights as trans children would be given a choice to make decisions about their bodies. Many people want to tell trans children that they are not trans, that boys cant dress as girls and much more. The idea that child shouldnt have a choice is a cruel idea, since some children never become adults. To deny them of choice during childhood means to deny them of choice for their entire life.
41. Banning child marriages harms economy and society
People who end up in prison stop being productive. Doctors who end up in prison are no longer able to provide medical services. Inventors who end up in prison will no longer invent. This makes everything more expensive, increasing poverty among adults and children. Children harmed by society's stigma will be less productive.
42. Survival of the fittest proves the power of child marriages and the value it has for society
Child marriage helped societies to survive. Societies before ours lived in a very difficult conditions. They needed to be at their best in order to survive. Those societies valued marriage and child marriage, and practiced it. If child marriage was bad for society, then societies who didnt practice it would be dominant. The opposite happened. Societies that practiced child marriage were dominant. Child marriage improved their birth rates, their economy and their ability to defend themselves. There were plenty of happy child marriages at that time. No one complained. Child marriage in ancient times saved children from being orphans. It took care of orphans. At that time, there was no foster care and no one wanted to take care of orphans except map. Without map, ancient orphans would all be reduced to begging in the street. People ignore all the benefits child marriages provided throughout history. Even Romeo and Juliet is based on child marriage that wasnt allowed to happen. Juliet was 14.
43. Having unsatisfied sexual urges is like feeling pain
If map are allowed to have one partner, they can satisfy urges legally in a way that doesnt harm them. If they are not allowed any partner, they cannot satisfy urges legally at all. And urges would still be there. Having urges that are unfullfilled is an equivalent of pain, since sexual urges are very strong and people are ready to risk their life and freedom to satisfy them.
44. Comparison of child to a drunk person doesnt work
If a person who is not drunk has sex with a drunk person, that person goes to prison for rape.
If two drunk people have sex, no one will go to prison despite that drunk people cant consent.
Adult can get drunk and have sex with a child, and then no one would get charged for rape because adult wouldnt have power to consent to sex.
We see that standards are inconsistent.
45. Attacking map means attacking victims of abuse
Life is not fair towards map. Many map were abused as children. They suffered a lot. To say that they should suffer more is a great injustice.
46. Map are not at fault for being map
Map didnt choose to be map. It was never their choice. Yet they suffer because of it. They are in pain. They feel guilty. Life dealt them bad cards.
Conclusion
In cases where children have sexual urges and act on their sexual urges, child marriages should be allowed. My case stands on strong ground, supported by lots of strong reasons. The harm of banning child marriage greatly outweights any benefits it might have.
Sources for information used in this debate:
"The Trauma Myth" - scientific book about adult-child relationships
Con
#8
Rebuttals
28. We see that it is not possible to prevent children from knowing about sex, with all the movies containing sex, and with child's curiosity to discover themselves, and with regular community talk which informs children, and with people who seek to inform children to build a relationship with them. You cant teach children not to have an urge. Entire history shows that controlling sexual urges is impossible to implement. It is also harmful and causes mental pain and discomfort, along with losing health benefits of sex, along with those who cant control their urges be judged by everyone and therefore, harmed. No country was able to stop children from acting on their urges, or adults from being with children.
People have free will. There is no going around that it is possible for children and adults not to have sex, even if the majority of the time they give in, they still have free will. And it's not always good to avoid pain. Pain is not bad, it's just something we don't enjoy so we tend to avoid it, but in fact it makes us stronger.
- Does freedom of sex and being able to make their own decisions really make children happy? If they are completely in charge of their lives, why should they have parents at all?
- A lot of pro's arguments center around the well-being of children. He says that marrying improves the child's life because they are in a loving relationship, ect. but what if they are not in a loving relationship? I know I have said this before, but it would be so easy for an adult to abuse a child. Pro said that with child marriages it would be easier for abusive relationships to be discovered and stopped, but why would they necessarily be easier to discover?
I'm sorry I added that quote at the end of my argument and would delete it if I could. I do not know if this is why pro did not respond to any of my points, but why ever it was, I hope he will consider rebutting these arguments.
Round 5
Pro
#9
Thank you for the debate.
I do sometimes ignore my opponent's case.
I am not always in the mood to do refutations.
They take a lot of time for me to do it well enough.
In any case, you were very fun to debate with.
Con
#10
I am rarely in the mood for refutations either, and that is why my arguments sometimes take a very long time. I am glad we had this debate and thank you for instigating it.
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Mostly dedication and lack of sleep. Often I have prepared text too.
How do you write back so fast?!